Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

[38P]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

Why not just return to flatheads and 1938-40 Ford coupe bodies? That's what they ran when NASCAR first started.

A better plan than staying stuck in 1975 would be to race what's actually for sale to the general public (with proper safety upgrades that is)

[Ron Ward]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah, what he said. I want to see 2-door Chargers on the street as well as the track!


Ron

[realsteelfreak]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

Well it might not be ovals,but if you want closer to stock cars based off production try Koni Challenge Series . Chargers,Camaros, and Mustangs mixing it up with BMW's and the like. Check out the rules for the series on the website.
http://grand-am.com/assets/KONI09rulesforweb8.pdf

[Matt Cramer]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

y'all ever hear of a yaw sensor ? g meter - tps ? nascar issues the msd boxes , but I think some traction control is goin on right now with one chase team [11] nascar could issue the pcm , but once you have the harness in there - a tiny - wireless device can be all that you need
the trick is - less techno , not more - go back to points or a dizzy that is self contained and issued by nascar - carbs - all that - heck , nascar could just take the advance mechanisms out of the ignition system , thats it , no more trouble , don't need it anyway
you just need traction control in the turns
we call it torque management

And you couldn't hide that in an ignition box because... ?

Most traction control systems you'll see, unless they're using a drive by wire, reduce power output by adjusting the spark timing, and could be pulled off on a carbureted car.

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

well they do that - gm came up with a gravity moving plate on the sbc , when it hit the turns , it retarded the timing a few degrees
now illegal
nascar hands out the msd boxes now
but , there are tricks a plenty with efi
other than cold start driveability and emissions and sophisticated traction control
what will make the racing better with efi ?
none of you have answer for it
other than some bullshit of getting with the times
who cares , we want hi speed fender banging and heroes
bling wings , heavy bling wheels and efi ain't going to do anything

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

that whole v6 thing was a failure , the bastards would eat up 3500 dollar crankshafts after 200miles - teams were going broke
the 9:1 thing was a failure - the exhaist temps were unbearable , cars became pizza oven
the price of progress is trouble
the whole cot thing is killing the receipts

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

Well it might not be ovals,but if you want closer to stock cars based off production try Koni Challenge Series . Chargers,Camaros, and Mustangs mixing it up with BMW's and the like. Check out the rules for the series on the website.
http://grand-am.com/assets/KONI09rulesforweb8.pdf

too bad it is on a *yawn* road course
the only event to see bmw compete is the demo derby - that would be a sellout
krush yuppie classic

[realsteelfreak]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

I have found the answer!!! The new NASCAR
http://jalopnik.com/tag/bumper-cars/

[Matt Cramer]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

what will make the racing better with efi ?

More consistent tuning in all weather, mostly.

Using EFI won't fix NASCAR, but maybe making the cars closer to production overall might. EFI would only be a small part of that - the biggest part would be using stock-looking body panels instead of making them look like the product of unnatural relations between a dirt track car and a 240SX. As it is, I have got to wonder how long sponsorship dollars are going to keep coming in from manufacturers when there's no connection between these cars and what they have in the showroom. We've already seen GM veto using the Camaro name on the COT because it didn't look like a Camaro. Unless the auto industry has a major turnaround, I suspect the next thing might be refusing to do much more work on an engine when none of the development work crosses over into production cars.

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

Why not just return to flatheads and 1938-40 Ford coupe bodies? That's what they ran when NASCAR first started.

A better plan than staying stuck in 1975 would be to race what's actually for sale to the general public (with proper safety upgrades that is)

you forget olds and chryslerhemis were the cars to beat in the first years of grand nationals
flatheads are farm implement motors that were obsolete in the post war era


why do you have to race what the lame public drives
a nissan sentra ? hahaha
that whole shrowroom racing premise went out the window when the carter administraion banned fun
1969 was the height of fun , lets keep in that way

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

I love taking swips at smokey flat motors , thanks for the opportunity mr bar graphs

[38P]

Re: Jim Beam and Jack Daniels Leave NASCAR

Why not just return to flatheads and 1938-40 Ford coupe bodies? That's what they ran when NASCAR first started.

A better plan than staying stuck in 1975 would be to race what's actually for sale to the general public (with proper safety upgrades that is)

you forget olds and chryslerhemis were the cars to beat in the first years of grand nationals
flatheads are farm implement motors that were obsolete in the post war era

Yeah, that would explain why the flathead 6-equipped Hudson Hornet won half of the NASCAR Manufacturer's championships before 1955.

http://www.legendsofnascar.com/Hudson.htm;

http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/motorsports/4303620.html?page=9

BTW, the architect of Hudson's success in NASCAR was one VINCE PIGGINS. http://www.hemmings.com/mus/stories/..._feature8.html

Bangshifters know Piggins later went on to run Chevrolet's clandestine motorsports operations (in violation of the AMA Ban and the 1963 GM Board's insistence upon abiding by it. Much of the reason that GM had so much success after factory support for NASCAR and drag racing dried up in the 1970s was the "heavy duty" parts operation that Piggins, Zora Arkus-Duntov and their co-conspirators had already put into place to circumvent the corporate "no racing" edict.)

Actually the flathead was technically obsolete as soon as the world had seen Peugeot's DOHC during the 1913 racing season. Jules Goux won the Indianapolis 500 in 1913 with a 4-valve Peugeot. Every four-valve powerplant from that day forward, including such legends as the 1967 Ford-Cosworth DFV and the venerable Offenhauser, owes much of their basic concept to a 1913 Peugeot!

But flatheads were cheap, easy to build, and made adequate power for ordinary driving.

Henry Ford's breakthrough of a cheap monoblock flathead V8 wasn't that much technological. (Even arch competitor Chevrolet had overhead valves) It was a breakthrough in price because it made V8s available to the masses.

Nor was Chevrolet's "Motoramic" 1955 V8 much of a technological breakthrough. It was merely a cheap-to-build, elegantly-simple application of mostly decades-old ideas.

My point was that picking out some era of history and tying racing to it probably says more about the nostalgia and manufacturer loyalties of the proponent than the inherent technological efficacy of that era.

If we're turning back the calendar to "fix" racing from the scourge of "technology," then the flathead has just as much or more of claim than does OHV engines.