Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

[cjforumadmin]

http://www.bangshift.com/blog/Autoextremist-NASCAR-May-be-on-the-road-to-un-sucking-Itself.html

[TheSilverBuick]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

YES! YES!! YES!!!

[Ron Ward]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

I will believe it when I see it.


Ron

[ferrarimanf355]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

Toyota's got a rear-wheel-driver, it's just badged as a Lexus.

Maybe we'll see the FT-86 in NASCAR if it makes it to production.

[stump_puller]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

This would be sweet if it ever happens. Back to the good 'ol days "win on sunday sell on monday"

[IRONHEAD]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

never happen..
the car might look like the stocker but thats it..
putting a unit body style on a highbanked oval.. would be a deathwish... even with a roll bar..
66% of the reason for the cot was fan safety.. after parts killed and mamed a few at races. with the old car that had the stocker roof/hood/deck lid

[38P]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

putting a unit body style on a highbanked oval.. would be a deathwish... even with a roll bar..

Gee, who knew that all of those Mustang FR500Cs (http://www.fordracingparts.com/mustang/herocard1.asp) and Porsche 911s (more correctly, the 997 GT3 RS model, as configured for Grand-Am GT competition) hitting the highbanks at Daytona International Speedway last weekend were such "deathwishes?"

Of course DeLorenzo's hardly alone in condemnation of the awful COT. See e.g. http://www.bangshift.com/blog/Speedy...er-s-Goat.html

[IRONHEAD]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

put that into a wall at 200 mph with another car following you in..
not a chance..

[horsewidower]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

Boy I wish folks would become more informed before they start typing out nonsense.

But opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

Unibody racecars are used all over the world and can be made as safe and stiff as needed. They are, however, frequently more expensive to build than tube framed silhouette racecars. They are also much more difficult to repair.

Bob

[IRONHEAD]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

Boy I wish folks would become more informed before they start typing out nonsense.

But opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

Unibody racecars are used all over the world and can be made as safe and stiff as needed. They are, however, frequently more expensive to build than tube framed silhouette racecars. They are also much more difficult to repair.

Bob

kinda take the point of use'n the stock body. now doesn't it ;)

[38P]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

For the purposes of argument, let's assume your conclusion is correct.

Then don't run'em at 200.

NASCAR racing would be just as good, if not better, if NASCAR used production bodies and CURRENT production engines with a Five Liter displacement limit (and I'm not just saying that because Ford's Coyote 5.0 would probably destroy Chevrolet . . . because GM would quickly have a NASCAR-ized DOHC five liter homologated or obtain a "equalization rule" such as in Daytona Prototype competition).

From an engineering standpoint, unitized and monocoque construction has proven itself in competition around the world. A separate tube frame is not necessary for either strength or "safety." In fact, the old Holman-Moody Fairlanes -- which helped start the deviations from "stock" -- were only 3/4 chassis cars. Chrysler's NASCARs in the 1960s and 1970s were unitized, with strategic tubing reinforcements. It wasn't until downsizing in 1981 that the separate frame/Galaxie front suspension/Galaxie floor pan/Chevy truck arm rear suspension specifications became required. Everything afterward until the COT (e.g. front steer, fabricated body sides) was a modifcation of the 1981 "box."

As long as the driver's compartment is adequately rigid (which can be accomplished with a proper cage, and body parts are properly affixed/tethered, there's simply no technical reason why a unibody cannot be run on any race track in America (other than hidebound sanctioning bodies preventing it).

[horsewidower]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

Boy I wish folks would become more informed before they start typing out nonsense.

But opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

Unibody racecars are used all over the world and can be made as safe and stiff as needed. They are, however, frequently more expensive to build than tube framed silhouette racecars. They are also much more difficult to repair.

Bob

kinda take the point of use'n the stock body. now doesn't it ;)

I don't have any idea what point you're trying to make there. You were arguing safety, now you're onto some different point when your safety argument is debunked.

Are you agreeing with me, or what...

[Schtauffer]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

With the factory body styles, expect those "factory-based" engines to be limited to 500 hp to reduce areo problems at high speeds.

[38P]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

Unibody racecars are used all over the world and can be made as safe and stiff as needed. They are, however, frequently more expensive to build than tube framed silhouette racecars. They are also much more difficult to repair.

Bob

kinda take the point of use'n the stock body. now doesn't it ;)

Not at all. Even if NASCAR were to turn back the clock to '81 (i.e. production-based bodies on a separate NASCAR chassis) it would improve brand identification and make the cars appear more "stock" to the fans.

But the cost argument is both unproven and unwarranted. In the superteam era, NASCAR racing is hardly an inexpensive sport. Designing and welding a cage unit and reinforcements into a production "body in white" on the scale of a superteam shouldn't be more expensive than totally fabricating a whole car from scratch. Moreover, production body cars could still be "clipped," so the repair costs shouldn't be that much higher. And strictly requiring stock body dimensions and factory body parts should eliminate much of the costs associated with developing and building special bodies for particular tracks (the COT was supposed to do this, but has failed because NASCAR doesn't use enough reference points on the fabricated COT body)

[horsewidower]

Re: Autoextremist: NASCAR May Return to Production Bodies and Engines

Speedy, I can only speak from my experience. Its from my experience that I form my opinion about the relative cost of unibody and tube framed racecars. Clearly from the standpoint of a NASCAR super team perspective, its probably "6 of one, half-dozen of another."

I suggest that you are underestimating the amount of prep needed to creat a competent unibody. It is far easier to lay some tubes and drape a body over it than it is to seam weld, hole drill and lay tube in an existing body shell.

But, I'm not a NASCAR team.