Barnstormin

[admin]

GM’s recent announcement that they are going to stop Chevy Volt production for five weeks in order to manage inventory levels is the latest piece of bad news to beset one of the most highly anticipated cars to ever come from Detroit. With the disparity between the build up and sales results, the Volt is [...]

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[TheSilverBuick]

I don't know what GM's margin of profit is on these cars (if any at all...) but the price is the killer. There is no sense of value against other cars in the 30-45mpg market. I ran some math and for me I'd probably save around $1,000 per year in gas (factoring in cost of increased electricty usage) compared to my truck, which knocks down to less than $500/yr comparing it to an econo-box car. That's a long long payback, if ever, versus purchasing a car getting 30+mpg. If it was a $20,000-$25,000 car I think it would do quite well.

Maybe they can re-invent it with a 500HP motor with a "race" mode toggle that gives you 5 minutes of high torque high horsepower out put.

[studemax]

As I understand it, GM is taking it in the shorts on every Volt sale to the tune of several thousand dollars. Add the fact that dealers are refusing to stock this modern-day Edsel on their lots, and with GM buying back used Volts from disgruntled owners - I'd say GM will get a heck of a write-off on this program.

Obama said he wanted one. He better get one now, before he loses his chance forever.

[mike343sharpstick]

I actually like the concept of the Volt.

If I could drive to and from work on a single charge, about 40 miles per day (which the volt can do) with a minimal uptick in my electric bill that would be a win. It's just too expensive.

If the batteries are drained, does anyone have the average cost to recharge it? I would like to compare that to my daily fuel cost.

I think the biggest problem for the pour car is that the individuals that are pushing for all of its green goodness are the sort of individuals that do a lot of talking and not much more. Stuff like this needs to be marketed as, this car could save you $$$ per year on fuel compared to a comparable gas powered car.

Saving money sells stuff, saving the planet just sounds good to a certain crowd.

[TheSilverBuick]

I too like the concept. Supposibly from what I've heard it's 16kWh from drained to charged. With say ten cents per kilowatt it's about $1.60 for that 30-40 miles (as opposed to $8 with a 15mpg truck, or $4 for a 30mpg car). The problem is the $10,000-$20,000 premium over similar sized compact car. So you save ~$2.40 a day compared to standard new compact car, that's 11 years (for five days a week commute) to make up the $10,000 cost difference from a compact car and it likely will need a battery pack in that time =/ And the better mpg's the compact car gets the longer the break even period is (assuming there is a break even point after maintence). Gas would have to skyrocket and electricity price remain fixed for the economics on buying one to get better.

[mike343sharpstick]

As you were typing that I was doing some similar math.
I based mine on cheaper electricity, .85 per killowat hour as you would likely be charging overnight when rates are less.
I also based the car's cost on $4 gas at 30 mpg with the same 40mile trip. I also based it on 6 trips per week.
I may have gotten my math wrong, i do that from time to time :/

Car - daily cost - Days driven per year - Yearly cost
Volt - $.85 - 312 - $265.2
Gas Car - $5.33 - 312 - $1662.96

yearly fuel savings = $1397.76

I did this in a spreadsheet, if gas goes up to $5 per gal. and electric rates stay the same the yearly savings is $1,812.72. So at $5 gas, things start to look much better for a car of this type!

[TheSilverBuick]

Adding in an extra day of driving is what really makes the pay back quicker. I actually only work 4.5 days (nine days in a row, five off) so the payback is even worse for me.

[mike343sharpstick]

I just ran the numbers using 14 mpg at 40 miles per day (My Dodge durango) and that gives me a savings of $3,563 per year. Wow.
Now obviously you can't compare a 4x4 suv to an econobox, when it snows or I need to pull a trailer I need the big D, but I think the numbers are interesting....
yeah, less days is a big part of the equation.

I'm probably typical in that I have 2 kids and work 20 miles away from home, as well as live 20 miles from shopping and such, so on Saturdays there is always a soccer game, trip to the store, etc.

Math is fun.

Even at a savings of $1,812, per year, a 'worst case' scenario it's hard to justify the extra cost over a 5 year span!

[andy30thz]

I think you guys got it right.
It just comes down to value. Nobody is willing to take a chance on a new technology when the pay off is breaking even at 5 or more years cost wise compared to a conventional gas motored car.

On the other hand, I don't know how people could expect a car manufacture to redesign the wheel and then charge the same or less for it than their older model.

One surprising lesson that hasn't seemed to be learned.....people buy cars based on how they look. Camaro sales are still pretty strong. I'll bet if you asked Camaro owners why they bought one, 80% would answer they liked how it looked. Not because of the performance, economy or technology.

I would bet consumers would be willing to give up 1-2mpg for less aerodynamics and better looks.
If the 2012 Caprice used the same team that did the Camaro body.... I bet they would sell a bunch!
It doesn't have to be retro, but it does have to be different. To get the aero, everyone uses a similar body shape. They need to find a way to create different body types without huge MPG penalties.

[TheSilverBuick]

I would bet consumers would be willing to give up 1-2mpg for less aerodynamics and better looks.
If the 2012 Caprice used the same team that did the Camaro body.... I bet they would sell a bunch!
It doesn't have to be retro, but it does have to be different. To get the aero, everyone uses a similar body shape. They need to find a way to create different body types without huge MPG penalties.

Amen to that. Get back to the days you could identify a car a block off by it's looks.

[BBR]

Don't forget your Durango is more than likely paid off and does not have to have full coverage insurance.

I wonder if the Volt's insurance rates are higher than regular cars?

Also don't forget that if gasoline/diesel prices rise, the cost of electricity will rise, albeit not by the same factor, but the power companies are going to pass that on to the consumer.

[Matt Cramer]

Spotted a Nissan Leaf on the freeway yesterday, but I understand Nissan's just about as hosed on that car. I've heard they haven't even sold 1,400 of those things in the US. And that one doesn't have the same political controversy attached to it as the Volt - mostly, it seems there's not a big market for electric cars out there.