Garage square footage and the 750 square foot question of the moment

[Eliteman76]

So it's been a while since I've posted, hope you guys are all doing good.
Life here has had way too many ups and downs and I got screwed royally a few times recently. But in my fashion, I'm still alive and kicking due to people who have been there for us.
Anyways, to the topic at hand, in my battle with the local city planning department to get a garage built, I'm limited to a 750 square foot structure.

I'm being told 750 square foot is the max.
So, I am asking exactly WHAT 750 square foot quote be, and can't get an answer.

My initial thought is like a 25x30, but I believe that may need to be more like 24x28 but I'm not 100%. Sorry, I need to read up a bit more as I'm drawing a complete blank on this deal and not prepared.

Aside from this, I'm trying to figure out the spacing in my back yard where I can place said garage. I've attached an initial image of my place with some lines of the garage, but I was off on my setbacks and found I need to be like 20 feet from my property line due to corner lot setback.
for reference the second picture has a fence where the setback in theory should hit.

The third image gives and idea of the size of the hill I have to contend with.

I have a couple thoughts about this and *screwed* comes into play as I didn't want to be building into a hill.

I've recently come up with a few ideas however and I'm contemplating this:

Garage in a 24x30 foot area.
Sinking the garage into the hill slightly...dig down around say 2 feet to drop the garage down. I originally was looking to run the access of the garage door to the east to joint my driveway but with the corrected position of the garage I may not have a good choice now, and run the door to the south on a separate drive.
This presents myself with a wonderful cluster F* of...a fire hydrant...that would be right in the driveway.

Right now, I am looking for the best use of a limited space.
I'm shooting for a two car with good working space.

I was debating the wall height. Ultimate goal is for a basic lift. I'm questioning if 10 foot walls are tall enough or if I need to shoot for something taller.

Any input on this would be helpful.

[DanStokes]

Weird zoning. I'd ask to see the restriction in the zoning ordinance that limits you. BTW - a little time on my calculator gives me 25X30 as your maximum size. Of course, that won't use standard building materials very efficiently so you might want to stick with 24X30 (720 sq. ft.). Believe me, however big it is it won't be big enough! My 1200 sq. ft. is marginal at best.

While you're looking at the actual restrictions (not taking their word for it) ask about the maximum HEIGHT. If you can go with 12 foot side walls you'll have lots of room for a future hoist - AND a mezzanine to stash your stuff - hoist in one bay and loft over the rest. You can squeeze a hoist in a 10 foot ceiling IF you use scissor trusses. You'll get lots more head room that way. Yep - built WAY too many shops! I have 1,000 other tips, too, so keep us posted.

Glad to see you back!

Dan

[74NovaMan]

Are the requirements different for attached vs detached? Maybe add on to the existing garage?

[Huskinhano]

I moved.

[Beagle]

Depending on where you want your lift, the truss type, and the roof pitch, a 10' wall could be fine. My walls are 10' and I'd have to put my hoist in the middle of the barn to be able to lift my Bronco to 6' without banging the trusses. If I were building new, I'd put a sharp pencil to the difference in cost for the 12' walls or plan on a higher pitch roof, or maybe a loft barn or whatever this is called, which I kind of like the style of:

[Loren]

A friend had a garage built where they engineered the truss plan so there was a box of sorts...the tie beams didn't have to go across in one section and there was space straight up into the peak so that a lift would work in there yet the building didn't have to be taller than the house. Was pretty slick.

[squirrel]

Howdy!

I'm 54 years old and still don't have/want a lift in my shop. You may be different.

10 is too short, you probably want 11' or higher ceiling. Although a shorter side wall, and scissor trusses, might be acceptable. But then the lift is in the middle of the shop, in the way most of the time. Either way, with only 750 sq feet, the lift will be in the way often.

If they let you build 750 sq feet then build 750 sq feet. No need to cut it down a foot or two to save half a sheet of plywood. Also, square gives you the most sq feet per linear foot of wall. But the layout of the shop, as far as parking cars, work space, work room, etc might dictate a different configuration.

I don't know what I'd do with only 750 sq ft of garage, and less than an acre of land!

[DanStokes]

Scissor trusses are a standard thing and just slightly more expensive than regular trusses. They are designed to make a cathedral ceiling while using a truss instead of stick framing - works great. I used them in Ann Arbor and they worked great though I had to be careful where I put the truck cab when I was going to lift a truck - has to be centered in the middle of the "cathedral".

Dan

[Loren]

I went to a lot of trouble last year to install a lift (free from a neighbor, he brought it home when his work upgraded) out in the dirt floor of the "car barn"...with a heavy utility box to take off my truck and an LT1 Firebird out in the yard which motor only comes out from the bottom, I don't know what I'd do without it. But yeah, otherwise you're just tripping over it. Most of the first 35 years of my life I didn't even have a roof to work under and did OK.

[DanStokes]

I've had a hoist for that last 20+ years and I really couldn't live without it. At my advanced age I'm too darn old to crawl under them and since I had the heart thing I can't work with my head lower than my heart so bending down and working is pretty much out of the question. Mine is right in the middle of my "working" stall and pretty much everything I build is on the hoist as I build it. GREAT for painting, too, as you can run the car up to paint the rockers and doors and lower it all the way down to spray the upper surfaces. So I guess I use mine differently from Loren - great minds don't ALWAYS think alike!

Having started out doing most of my work in Michigan I require a roof - AND HEAT! If I was in SOCAL I might have a different view on this.

Dan

[MR P-BODY]

I built a new shop about 5 years ago... I went with a metal
structure .. best thing I could have done... I was trying to
build it as a 2000 sqft building but I was limited to less.. we
have a ordinance that says 2 out buildings with a total area
combined of 2500sqft... my pole barn is 1200 sqft.. I ended
up with 1300+ sqft on my shop.. in concrete hot water heat
and 12' walls.. the hoist is in the center with a small machine
shop area to one side(mill, lathe, welders and other assorted
machines).. it works well but ANY shop will never be large
enough if you plan on working in it... I also set it up with a
small office/clean room for building engines.. in the spring I
plan on putting a 2' wide shelve around the perimeter at 7' up
for storage... chains will come down from the steel trusses to
support the outer edges of it so that way it wont have anything
going to the floor to get in the way.... check your ordinances and
see if you can attach it to the house.. in my case IF I did I could
have built it any size I wanted... also check and see if it can be
zoned a little differently.. the guy down the road from me grows
Bees and he got to build a 4000 sqft building with a full second
floor.... but as of last year they changed the ordinance so a larger
building can be built (greater than the 2500sqft total) even with
the 2 out building.. I'm thinking of adding on to mine... see if a
varance will help you(love letters from the neighbors)

[Eliteman76]

Thanks guys. I live in a nazi police state of Bellevue Nebraska.
If I go for attached to my house, then I'm dealing with a setback issue leaving me with all of 7 feet allowable space behind the garage, and 10 feet to the south of my house. Totoal BS considering the size of my lot.

In floor radiant heat would be killer especially in the Nebraska climate but it's for my city code it's a nightmare to get approved from discussing with two other guys that are dealing with similar issues to mine.

I've got a limitation of a MAX of 15 feet for overall height on a detached structure. In discussing things with a few guys I've been examining rafter types and I have debated stick frame vs a pole barn.

I'm leaning to a pole barn setup because of rafters on a 15 foot max roof height limit usable space.
My thought was a attic type rafter setup so I am able to drive a vehicle into the center of the garage and have a lift so i can pick up my F series.
The Torino is fairly short compared to the F series but I want access for working on a full size truck. I wanted to stay away from a twin post lift so I'm not dealing with a permanent structure item in the garage, unlike a 4 post where it could be moved around...BUT for the time being I need to focus on the garage first. Lift will come later as budget and sanity permit.
I'd love to also just sink a foundation for a 2 ton jib crane in one corner...but I need to keep my feet planed on the ground.

Regarding wall heights though I am contemplating seeing if I can build this where the garage drops into the hill 2 feet, that way I still only have a 10 foot side wall facing the front of the property from where they account for the grade level at the front of the house.

Here's some of the planning details:
Accessory buildings shall be permitted in all residential zoning districts in accordance with the following guidelines:
1. All accessory buildings shall be set back a minimum of five (5) feet from side and rear lot lines, accessory buildings shall not be permitted in the front yard or in the required street side yard setback, and accessory buildings shall not be allowed within an existing easement.
2. The maximum height of an accessory building, as measured from grade level at the front of the building to the highest ridgeline of the accessory building, shall be fifteen (15) feet, provided one (1) additional foot of height shall be permitted for every two (2) feet of additional setback from the minimum setback from the nearest boundary line, but in no event shall an accessory building be taller than the highest ridgeline of the principal building on the lot, as measured in feet from grade level at the front of the principal building to the highest ridgeline of the principal building.
ARTICLE 4: GENERAL PROVISIONS
BELLEVUE, NEBRASKA  ZONING ORDINANCE  2011 Update 49
3. Accessory buildings shall be permitted in the side yard provided they meet the minimum setback of the zoning district and are constructed with frost-free footings.
4. On lots one acre in size or smaller, the footprint of accessory buildings may be no larger than the greater of seven hundred fifty (750) square feet or fifty (50) percent of the building footprint of the principal structure on the lot, but in no event greater than one thousand two hundred (1,200) square feet. The area of eaves or overhangs greater than two (2) feet in depth shall be included in the building footprint area.
5. On lots greater than one acre in size, the footprint of accessory buildings may be no larger than one thousand two hundred (1,200) square feet. The area of eaves or overhangs greater than two (2) feet in depth shall be included in the building footprint area.
6. The total square footage of the principal building and any accessory buildings on a lot shall not exceed the maximum ground coverage permitted in the zoning district.
7. Detached garages and outbuildings in residential districts for storage uses and other structures customary and appurtenant to the permitted uses shall be constructed of materials customarily used in residential construction and be consistent with materials and color of the principal structure. The roofs of said building shall have a minimum 3:12 pitch. (Ord. No. 3761, April 14, 2014)

I'll get back when i have some more info on the garage but layout is a thing on my mind.

[DanStokes]

My shop here was a kit from Kentucky Steel Truss Building Company. Last I knew they were still active. Anyhow, great to work with. There's an ancient thread on here showing the erecting process but basically the trusses make up the uprights and the rafters and come in 4 pieces. Once bolted together you have a big structural shape that looks like the outline of a building but with no crossties or other obstructions. The mezzanine fits right in with room to walk around for much of it. The peak is 17 1/2 feet with 12 feet at the eves so you could probably easily go 10 feet at the eves and be under the 15' restriction. I'm convinced that steel frame is the way to go. Mine is all steel (including the perlins and girts) including the siding but if your city wants wood on the outside you could side it with T-111 or similar and still use the steel perlins and girts which works to keep the screws from backing out. If you go this way I have many more hard-won tricks like how to keep the roof screws from leaking - forever.

The down side of all my shops has been that all of them have a magnetic attraction to extra auto parts and none of them have been self-cleaning. The bigger they are the more crud they'll attract.

The concrete was the expensive part, almost as much as the building kit.

Dan

[Eliteman76]

I thought about a pole building but I'm OCD {or is it CDO?} obsessive about certain details.
One of the things that just came up is locally there is a garage for sale. It's only a 24x24, something like 7 or 8 foot walls on a slab. Guy bought a house and is slowly demo-ing it.

One of my buddies bought a 24x24 garage in a similar deal and took it down and carefully sectioned, moved it and put it up behind his house on a new slab.
I'm going to look over it this weekend and look at it.

My thoughts are doing a block foundation and stretch the garage to a 24x30 I want 25x30 to maximize the 750 sq foot but if this is fate so be it...for what the guy is asking for the garage I think it's worth my time to tear it apart and move it.

At that point the discussion I had was take and do a 4 foot block wall and land the wall sections on top of the brick.
This way it gives me an 11 foot interior wall height, and I have block near the ground instead of wood that will get snow against it in the winter and lead to rot.
At least this is how my mind is thinking.

Dan, one thing I have looked at is a metal building...but I don't think it's the right fit in my neighborhood. None of the other garages are metal and my wife said she wants the garage to blend with the house.

[MR P-BODY]

This is what mine looked like when it was basically done...
colors match the house... looked 100 times better than what
I tore down and replace.. I had the driveway sealed after this

and did the grass and the exterior electrical after this pic..
I put in 110 and 220 on the front exterior wall so I can weld
out there if needed... after owning this now I would never
build a stick frame again for a out building... I cant believe
you would have a hard time with the in concrete heating..
its just a plumbing permit.. when I was done and had the
final on the plumbing I had to explain to him all the stuff and
the reason for the different things... it has more safety items
than are even called for... he was super happy with it