New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

[Aircooled]

Unfortunately, this is no April Fools joke...

from http://money.cnn.com/2010/04/01/auto...inal/index.htm

"By the 2016 model year, cars will be expected to average about 39 mpg while trucks are expected to get an average of 30 mpg."

vs. "Current fuel economy standards for new cars are 27.5 mpg for cars and 23.5 mpg for trucks".

Let's see, that a 40% increase in cars and a 27% increase in Trucks fuel econ in 5 years.
Should be easy, huh?

Oh, you can't rely entirely on diesels to meet those new numbers because "The EPA will enforce new emissions rules which require vehicles, on average, to emit no more than 250 grams of carbon dioxide per mile."

[dieselgeek]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAqPMJFaEdY&feature=PlayList&p=5C2349897024CAE4&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=14

[IRONHEAD]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

so. thats fleet av.
all that means is the v8 truck cost will go up. to force you into a v6
same with cars..

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

cardboard construction

[Aircooled]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

so. thats fleet av.
all that means is the v8 truck cost will go up. to force you into a v6
same with cars..

Name a V-6 truck that gets 30 MPG combined city/highway.

[Hemi Joel]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

I don't get it. If they can raise mileage just by passing a law, why stop at 23 mpg. ???

I want a truck that gets 400 mpg. Why don't they raise the standard to 400? That will save me alot of $$$. ;)

[IRONHEAD]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

so. thats fleet av.
all that means is the v8 truck cost will go up. to force you into a v6
same with cars..

Name a V-6 truck that gets 30 MPG combined city/highway.

they'll have to,
it can be done..
you don't need 300hp in a soccer mom suv or 4 door p/u

[uhcrandy]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

I should be able to choose. Maybe I WANT 300hp!!!! Ok, I do want 300hp...

[ponchoman]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

Lowering hp doesn't do a darned thing for fuel economy by itself. Go buy a new truck and drop in a 120hp 4 banger and see what kind of mileage you get in terrain that isn't flat. Often the mileage will be worse. Like 1/2 ton trucks w/ the V6 rather than the 5.3 motors, laboring up and down hills and eating more fuel.

There is such a thing as the law of diminishing returns. It's like drag racing. You can get your F-Body down from 15 sec in the 1/4 to 13 sec for a grand. Try getting from 11 sec to 9 sec. Or 8 sec to 6 sec. At the end of the day it's the consumer who will pay in the form of higher prices, and giving up either safety or capacity.

What it really means is lighter construction, higher compression, higher engine temps, more expensive and difficult maintenance, worse drivability and lower cargo/towing capacity. And it will drive up way more than the cost of just putting a V8 in. In order to make the avg numbers, the FLEET has to change. So, if you need a pulling truck? Good luck with that. Have fun pulling an 8000lb trailer with a truck that weights 3500lbs and has 200 tq. That'll be even more fun in the wind.

Just because the govt says they "have to" doesn't mean they can. If it were that easy, KW, Peterbuilt, Freightliner, etc would all have tractors that averaged 40mpg because it's all about utility and cost for them. No yuppy moms to blame.

[moparmaniac07]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

I'd give up a little bit of safety for fuel economy, but fuel economy actually increases with power in a lot of instances. Making the engine more efficient, better airflow, better burning, will add to both numbers, but there's only so much energy in a gallon of fuel. There's also only so efficient an engine can get, but lawmakers don't really understand thermodynamics or physics and make laws without being able to understand the consequences.

[Barry Donovan]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

Unfortunately, this is no April Fools joke...

from http://money.cnn.com/2010/04/01/auto...inal/index.htm

"By the 2016 model year, cars will be expected to average about 39 mpg while trucks are expected to get an average of 30 mpg."

vs. "Current fuel economy standards for new cars are 27.5 mpg for cars and 23.5 mpg for trucks".

Let's see, that a 40% increase in cars and a 27% increase in Trucks fuel econ in 5 years.
Should be easy, huh?

Oh, you can't rely entirely on diesels to meet those new numbers because "The EPA will enforce new emissions rules which require vehicles, on average, to emit no more than 250 grams of carbon dioxide per mile."

3 main boxer anybody?
my "little" sube is still out there, 80s mph with a car load..no problem. I had to rework it to stop hypermiling...

I sincerely ponder a benz crank v8...don't be scared engineers, quit being little girls over real engines... :

[IRONHEAD]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

sorry not buy'n it..
I'l bet a 6 speed auto with an over/under(think gearvendors) will not labor with a 4 cyl..
other countries do it..
you'll still be able to get a v8 truck.. it just won't be a 1/2 ton..
there is also no need for a 1/2 ton truck to weight 5000lb+
I like my v8 just like everyone here, but, face it..
now that , the in thing has been full sized trucks/suv's for the family hauler..
they are going to , kill it.. or make it very costly to own..
remember, before yuppies and there dolled up trucks..
trucks where basic and CHEAP. once it became the "in" vehicle.. you can't find a cheap one..
they will find away to get the mpg out of them, and them not be slugs.
7 and 8 speed trannies and a turbo for the big time low rpm ft lb's will be the calling card..
and they'll cug around at 1200-1300 rpm on the hyway with the turbo giving you all the ftlb to climb that hill with no issue..
all this stuff is on shelves NOW..

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

where in enumerated powers that limit government is it written that they can dictate car/truck design ?


better times ahead

[antmnte]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

Yeah they can pass all the laws they want. I want a car that gets 200 MPG no 300, ahhhh! what the hell just keep passing laws .Jerkoff's

[ponchoman]

Re: New CAFE standrds for 2016 anounced today

Sorry, but I don't buy that adding a 6spd will allow a 1/2 truck sufficient power. Maybe if you live at the salt flats, but not around here. Current 2010 4.3 and 4.8 motors truly struggle around here, and people avoid them. They typically get worse real world fuel economy around here than the 5.3, which is "OK".

I also don't buy that trucks don't need to weigh 5000lbs. Maybe a little math would be in order. If you're going to pull 5000 lbs (LOW weight), and you don't want your tow vehicle pushed around, how do you alter the laws of physics?

Other countries DON'T do it. As somebody who has lived in other countries and travels to them as well as other people on this site who live there, you need to recognize the differences. You don't see 22 ft boats being pulled around in other countries. You don't see race car trailers being pulled around in other countries. Frankly, you don't see the majority of people owning their own home in other countries. Perhaps the argument should be whether we want to be just like "other countries" in all the ways that matter? If we want to become France, then it's a different story.

Turbos do not give you low end torque in small displacement high efficiency motors. Show me one. Just one. I'm not talking about soccer mom driving her suburban. I'm talking about the tons of trucks we all see every day being driven by people who use them. The real problem is that manufacturers can no longer afford to have tons of models and variations, so we will all - ALL - suffer with vehicles that don't perform to what is being asked simply because the federal government WANTS to have something.

Again, show me the long haulers with small displacement motors. The over the road trucks that do this every day for a living, where operational costs are criticially important. They're not yuppy mom drivers. They're professionals and trucking companies trying to make money. So, if they could get better mileage it would be a huge sales/product advantage that would increase sales. I'm not seeing it.