Patriot heads SBC

[Scott Liggett]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

So yeah or no on the 406 ? I dont know what i want yet. Im kinda kicking it around but thanks for the road recommendation. Can one be built say with 9-9.5:1 comp. ? Am I better off going with a 383? I liked that 408 in that 55
that was in Car craft a while ago too but it looks like a PITA to build. (I should just start another thread)

I wouldn't copy any of Ted Toki's crazy ideas.

Patriot's and most others' heads are just copies of Edelbrock's RPM heads. One company makes them in Australia that I hear is pretty darned good.

[jcharliem]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

I'm not sure a 406 is the best way to go for a street motor as I've heard lots of guys who know stuff say that the rod angle will promote accelerated piston ring wear. That's just what I've heard, and there are obviously lots of them out there.

That is why you go with a 5.7 or 6 inch rod. ;)


The 406 in my '71 Camaro has a Crower 4340 non-twist forged crank, Manley H-beam rods(5.7), TRW Forged Pistons, Total Seal Rings. The Block is a GM 509 block that has been treated to splayed caps and a ton of machine work. An Edelbrock gear drive turns the Crower solid roller cam with specs of 303/312 adv. duration, with 270/278 .050 duration, and .675/.675 lift on a 103 LSA. The heads are Sportsman II's with 2.08 and 1.625 valves and they have been treated to some heavy port work. It's all topped off with a Weiand Team-G single plane intake and a 800 holley DP. Also I have about 13:1 compression using a Flat Top piston. The combo should be good for 600-650 hp and that doesn't even include the NOS Big Shot system I have on it which is good for another 350hp.

Other goodies in the motor are a Crower Rev kit, Comp one piece custom pushrods, Comp Pro Magnum Roller Rockers, Crane stud girdle, a Fluidampr and a Milodon diamond scraper windage tray. Plus the heads and main caps are studded. And the headers are a pair of Hooker Super Comps 1 7/8" primary to a 3 1/2" collector. And topped off with a Complete assortment of MSD ignition. ;)

Is that thing ever going to run? :

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

chev sells a crate 383

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/NAL-12499101/

available at summit or your local gm dealer

[antmnte]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

So yeah or no on the 406 ? I dont know what i want yet. Im kinda kicking it around but thanks for the road recommendation. Can one be built say with 9-9.5:1 comp. ? Am I better off going with a 383? I liked that 408 in that 55
that was in Car craft a while ago too but it looks like a PITA to build. (I should just start another thread)

[SpiderGearsMan]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

that thing will be great [once it is done ]

[TC]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

I'm not sure a 406 is the best way to go for a street motor as I've heard lots of guys who know stuff say that the rod angle will promote accelerated piston ring wear. That's just what I've heard, and there are obviously lots of them out there.

That is why you go with a 5.7 or 6 inch rod. ;)


The 406 in my '71 Camaro has a Crower 4340 non-twist forged crank, Manley H-beam rods(5.7), TRW Forged Pistons, Total Seal Rings. The Block is a GM 509 block that has been treated to splayed caps and a ton of machine work. An Edelbrock gear drive turns the Crower solid roller cam with specs of 303/312 adv. duration, with 270/278 .050 duration, and .675/.675 lift on a 103 LSA. The heads are Sportsman II's with 2.08 and 1.625 valves and they have been treated to some heavy port work. It's all topped off with a Weiand Team-G single plane intake and a 800 holley DP. Also I have about 13:1 compression using a Flat Top piston. The combo should be good for 600-650 hp and that doesn't even include the NOS Big Shot system I have on it which is good for another 350hp.

Other goodies in the motor are a Crower Rev kit, Comp one piece custom pushrods, Comp Pro Magnum Roller Rockers, Crane stud girdle, a Fluidampr and a Milodon diamond scraper windage tray. Plus the heads and main caps are studded. And the headers are a pair of Hooker Super Comps 1 7/8" primary to a 3 1/2" collector. And topped off with a Complete assortment of MSD ignition. ;)

[milner351]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

Not that there aren't plenty o choices for SBF heads as it is... but I like summit and would like to support them when I can as well, especially when they use good American's to build thier stuff.

Don't worry - I won't go BOP on ya - but can't you grind a BBB to use BBC rods?

My FE stroker crank uses BBC rods. ;D

[milkovich]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

nope SBC and BBC only.

They probably figure it'd upset the balance of the universe if you guys didn't have to pay the "Ford tax." Still, that's just a taste of what it's like to be a buick guy (eagle doesn't even make BBB rods :'().

[milner351]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

John

Are the summit heads available for Fords?

[milkovich]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

I ran a set of these Patriots on a 383 in my truck and didn't have any problems (other then not having enough gear for the cam and victor jr I had on the engine). The flow numbers were good too for a cast head. If I had to complain it'd be that they're machined for both centerbolt and perimiter valvecovers and it was hard to get my perimiter's to seal. I'd have run centerbolts but I already had wide body rockers. Something to think about if you don't have the rockers yet.

FWIW, the Summit heads are all cast/machined/assembled in the US.

antmnte, I'm not sure the 406 would have bad angles for a street motor. Lots of 3.75" stroke motors running around out there with no problems. I think a lot of the "wives tales" come from assuming that racing failures will happen at street RPM. By that logic, stock 5.0 mustangs would have all exploded on the drive home from the dealership because of their thin castings. Consider that the 400 had a shorter rod from the factory even though it will take a 5.7 or 6" rod and the 400's were obviously severe duty engines in 3/4 ton trucks and fullsize chevs. The only guys I've ever seen de-stroke a 400 on a regular basis are circle track guys and yeah, a 3.75 stroke is probably too long for extended periods of 8000 rpm with factory castings.

[milner351]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

I'll third that idea.... love the fact that it's been a family affair for so long too. You and Chad have that going for ya - pops and grand pops that are into cars. Me - not so much.

Some of the stroker piston geometry gets a little scarey - sweet for a drag motor, circle or road race or street, not so much.

Short piston skirts with big angles shoved into the thrust face of the block do not spell durability.... but they can make stupid power in a small package.

With the uber high quality parts in the Senior Lohne's 406 - I don't guess there will be issues, but I'd hate to see the aftermath of a cheapo import ebay stroker kit.

[Monster]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

Me too, me too.
I love Nova's ..... and a 406ci SBC ??
Oh yeah baby !!
;D

[Bamfster]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

I for one would love to see a full feature on the nova Brian ... :

[Brian Lohnes]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

Brian,can you give some more detail to that 406 ? Im thinking about one for my Monte Carlo (the one in the pic)
what going on inside and where did the stuff come from (rotating assembly) ?

It may be a little much for a street car with the 14.5:1 compression but...

It has a Callies crank, Oliver rods, JE pistons, Comp Cam, based in a Dart Little M block and topped with Dart Pro 1 heads, an Edelbrock Super Victor intake manifold and an alky Holley carb (car runs on methanol).

It is in a 1970 Nova which weighs 2900-3,000lbs and it'll go high 9.80s on a good day with the right air.

I'm not sure a 406 is the best way to go for a street motor as I've heard lots of guys who know stuff say that the rod angle will promote accelerated piston ring wear. That's just what I've heard, and there are obviously lots of them out there.

In the race car, it's a pretty bitchin' piece!

[Bamfster]

Re: Patriot heads SBC

I personally favor Maskin's stuff, and they went above and beyond when I needed a set repaired ....

Who makes the the Summit brand stuff? or is that it?

Why not Vortecs?