MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

[dieselgeek]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

what about the 50,000 dollar carburetors ?

don't forget 3000-10,000 dyno pulls on those carbs at minimum $150 an hour.

maybe if the dyno isn't yours..
I'm willing to bet alot of teams have their own..

And I bet they got them for free from the Dyno Fairy. Yep, carbs are cheaper in ProStock, sure.

[TC]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

what about the 50,000 dollar carburetors ?

don't forget 3000-10,000 dyno pulls on those carbs at minimum $150 an hour.

I'm going to have to say that 10,000 dyno pulls is pure BS. At 10,000 it would be something like a dyno pull every 5 minutes for 12 hours straight for 70 days in a row.

From a more realistic point of view doing a dyno pull every 10 minutes for only 8 hours a day you'd be looking at 208 working days to do those 10,000 dyno pulls.

Sometimes man I think you embellish just a little to much. ;)

[dieselgeek]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

what about the 50,000 dollar carburetors ?

don't forget 3000-10,000 dyno pulls on those carbs at minimum $150 an hour.

I'm going to have to say that 10,000 dyno pulls is pure BS. At 10,000 it would be something like a dyno pull every 5 minutes for 12 hours straight for 70 days in a row.

A basic NASCAR carburetor, well tuned, that was used for a few Engine Masters engines around 10 years ago (and hasn't been legal in EMC for a number of years since) took somewhere between 1000-2000 pulls. The "cheap rate" for dyno time is $100/hour. And there's nobody making significant changes to a carb between pulls in under 10 minutes, ANYWHERE. That was tuning by non-nascar, entry level dyno operators. I'm *quite* sure that 10,000 pulls to sort out an engine's state of tune, in professional levels of racing, is neither embellished nor absurd.

From a more realistic point of view doing a dyno pull every 10 minutes for only 8 hours a day you'd be looking at 208 working days to do those 10,000 dyno pulls.

You should realize that there are guys who are paid deep six figures per year to sort out carburetor/intake/exhaust tunes on NASCAR engines, and they do this fulltime and are in huge demand... 208 days to develop a combo, in that world, is short & cheap.

So, no, I don't think you'll find anyone knowledgable in that arena who would agree with you that I am "embellishing" anything

[Tazracing]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

and like magic efi is gonna do away with all those dyno and r&d hours..
B/S it might be faster to hit a key than change a jet but, they'll still test the weeeeeeeeeeee
out of it..
I'm sure most engine masters testing was done after hours and with equipment they already had acess to.
just like the machining and averything else, never mind the priceless free press that comes with it..

I'm sorry, efi will still use as many dyno and r&d hours, teams will not say thats good enough they'll test and test and test..

I'm sure d/g will say different,

[dieselgeek]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

and like magic efi is gonna do away with all those dyno and r&d hours..
B/S it might be faster to hit a key than change a jet but, they'll still test the weeeeeeeeeeee
out of it..
I'm sure most engine masters testing was done after hours and with equipment they already had acess to.
just like the machining and averything else, never mind the priceless free press that comes with it..

I'm sorry, efi will still use as many dyno and r&d hours, teams will not say thats good enough they'll test and test and test..

I'm sure d/g will say different,

Let's do a quick review of what is the main point of 99.94% of your posts: "EFI sucks."

Yet you just stated that EFI will let testers cover more ground than carb tuning over the same amount of dyno tuning hours. That means, EFI gives more value for the dollar, whether or not you use that free time to (a) save money or (b) go with further developement, you've shown clearly that EFI > Carb.

Normally, when we talk about EFI, you argue that we are not factoring in the costs of all the little details, which means EFI costs a million more dollars than we're stating - yet here, you claim that people should be able to get deals, ffree machine work, etc etc. I think the point here is, you're not really interested in EFI *or* carburetors, you're interested in talking nonstop BS on this forum.


Hit me up when you have an EFI system ready for installation and tuning because it's getting old answering the same dumb questions over and over and over again.

[JeffMcKC]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

The facts are a couple of the Local POO POO'ers have not got a real Clue. Most engines are leased from just a few builders in the upper end of all engine sports and the Carbs when they find a "Good pair" or in Singles tend to stay with the owners of the car or go from engine to engine because they cant repeat whats "Good" about that one, but they will let you screw their ol lady before you will get hold of them.

[Tazracing]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

and like magic efi is gonna do away with all those dyno and r&d hours..
B/S it might be faster to hit a key than change a jet but, they'll still test the weeeeeeeeeeee
out of it..
I'm sure most engine masters testing was done after hours and with equipment they already had acess to.
just like the machining and averything else, never mind the priceless free press that comes with it..

I'm sorry, efi will still use as many dyno and r&d hours, teams will not say thats good enough they'll test and test and test..

I'm sure d/g will say different,

Let's do a quick review of what is the main point of 99.94% of your posts: "EFI sucks."

Yet you just stated that EFI will let testers cover more ground than carb tuning over the same amount of dyno tuning hours. That means, EFI gives more value for the dollar, whether or not you use that free time to (a) save money or (b) go with further developement, you've shown clearly that EFI > Carb.

Normally, when we talk about EFI, you argue that we are not factoring in the costs of all the little details, which means EFI costs a million more dollars than we're stating - yet here, you claim that people should be able to get deals, ffree machine work, etc etc. I think the point here is, you're not really interested in EFI *or* carburetors, you're interested in talking nonstop BS on this forum.


Hit me up when you have an EFI system ready for installation and tuning because it's getting old answering the same dumb questions over and over and over again.

where in my post did I say efi sucks,, you on the otherhand believe teams are gonna save so much time and money, sorry I don't think they will, as teams do r&d to get an edge any edge they can and when efi is used it'll be no damn different..

[dieselgeek]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

but... these go to Eleven

[horsewidower]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

Like in all professional racing, teams will R&D to the extent that money allows. No team gives money back to a sponsor, they will consume it all. And then ask for more.

This is no different in that respect, and I believe that Mark is correct to the extent that his comments are directed there.

I do, however, believe that the nature of the R&D changes, and that the ability to test will be easier and quicker.

Will they spend as much money, you bet. But maybe less money will need to be allocated to induction issues and more money can be directed elsewhere in the development program. Maybe more goes to aero, or chassis dynamics, or data acquisition, etc.

Or, maybe the team will actually have a return on investment and be able to stay in the game longer.

Bob

[groucho]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

I'm calling bullshit on the rule changes.

[TC]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

what about the 50,000 dollar carburetors ?

don't forget 3000-10,000 dyno pulls on those carbs at minimum $150 an hour.

I'm going to have to say that 10,000 dyno pulls is pure BS. At 10,000 it would be something like a dyno pull every 5 minutes for 12 hours straight for 70 days in a row.

A basic NASCAR carburetor, well tuned, that was used for a few Engine Masters engines around 10 years ago (and hasn't been legal in EMC for a number of years since) took somewhere between 1000-2000 pulls. The "cheap rate" for dyno time is $100/hour. And there's nobody making significant changes to a carb between pulls in under 10 minutes, ANYWHERE. That was tuning by non-nascar, entry level dyno operators. I'm *quite* sure that 10,000 pulls to sort out an engine's state of tune, in professional levels of racing, is neither embellished nor absurd.

From a more realistic point of view doing a dyno pull every 10 minutes for only 8 hours a day you'd be looking at 208 working days to do those 10,000 dyno pulls.

You should realize that there are guys who are paid deep six figures per year to sort out carburetor/intake/exhaust tunes on NASCAR engines, and they do this fulltime and are in huge demand... 208 days to develop a combo, in that world, is short & cheap.

So, no, I don't think you'll find anyone knowledgable in that arena who would agree with you that I am "embellishing" anything

So what your saying is the season is over by the time they get the carb tuned. ;)

[CDMBill]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

I'm calling bullshit on the rule changes.

I thought everybody knew this was an April Fools joke and was just doing the usual arguing for arguing's sake we seem to do so well here.

[groucho]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

I'm calling bullshit on the rule changes.

I thought everybody knew this was an April Fools joke and was just doing the usual arguing for arguing's sake we seem to do so well here.

I guess I keep forgetting about all the hillbilly truck and Rambler lovers on this board with nothing better to do :P :-* ;D

[horsewidower]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

LOL!!

Just one big dysfunctional family of car lovers.

[Brian Lohnes]

Re: MAJOR RULE CHANGES COMING TO NHRA PRO STOCK?

Groucho FU! My truck doesn't have EFI!

Oh wait...what?