To stroke or not to stroke

[SuperBuickGuy]

Started this in the tech section, but think it belongs here...

So I'm going to put together another long block for my Skylark. Most of me wants to get the extra cubic inches; but the problem is, I'm not finding any motivation to do so (other than impressing the lawn chair crowd, whom, I couldn't care less about).

why stroke a BBB? They already have fragile bottom ends, and require really expensive heads to have a flow that matches the increased cubes.... and then there's hairdryers....

but that's not the real question - I'm in a "why bother" mood, for the same money I could put a supercharger on the GTO be twice as fast and get better fuel economy. So why bother with anything more than a ring job and new bearings? with the Buick, unless it has a chevy motor in it, it's just not exciting (read, really not much good for anything other than fairgrounds).... it's just another BBB.

[Beagle]

I have wondered similar thoughts recently. Magazines have me trained to want to stroke everything. I think the 5.4 Ford has more stroke than a BBB, BBF, or BBC and it runs like crap until you put a blower on it.

I'd spend some of the money a stroker would add on the heads. 500hp is plenty for a street car. Please don't ban me for saying that.

[milkovich]

I totally "get" why guys go all out on BOP engines but to me, it's about value. When a guy with a well thought out 455 and a quadrajet goes 12s or quicker, it's as awesome as an all out race engine. Strokers are cool to read about, but until they make chinese cranks for buicks, I wouldn't worry about it. No way would I put a billet crank in a crappy buick block unless I was obnoxiously rich.

[JeffMcKC]

Dont worry about, put some good heads, cam and intake on it and SOME 4.10s in the back. We went 10.80s with a 455 and Factory iron heads.

[SpiderGearsMan]

LSX 454 it ..still be cheaper than a buick

[A/Fuel]

"A ring job and new bearings"?

Thats like saying "just lift your shirt up a little and I'll stop there."

[TheSilverBuick]

The good stroker package is only to a 470", so a gain of 15cid. Which to me seems pretty trivial considering the size of the engine already.

I don't know if it was the rotating assembly balancing, the cam, or the heads (or probably all three..) but I really like the feel and smoothness of my most recent 455 assembly. Real smooth and no issues revving right to 6,000rpm. I too am fighting that fear of exceeding the block limitations. My timing and fuel tune are far from optimized, and I'm mostly okay with that since I don't want to drive over my crankshaft.

That being said, get some forged pistons, grind on some heads or pickup a decent set, and get a mid-range cam capable of getting the car deep into the 12's or high 11's.

[Stich496]

depends, whats in your reading room..

[STINEY]

I'll answer your question with another question.........

Would you stroke the Cadillac 500? What would you say to me if I was considering it?

[A/Fuel]

I have another question,
I'm not to familiar with how fragil Buick bottom ends are, but wouldn't adding stroke allow you to make more power down low and not stress the bottom end out as much as if you had to spin it higher? But like Randall says, 15 inches, doesn't seem like a lot.

[SuperBuickGuy]

I have the same question for both you, Stiney, and A/F.... how?

A/F - I'm really interested in the details of that motor. Your second question, it's like my diesel, it wins every 20' race... all the kits/builds I've seen don't give you much more torque.... of course, they come with 510 ft lbs stock, so "more" may not mean much unless you've put it in something really heavy.

Stiney - it'd make more sense because the bottom end could handle the horses, and I'd say you need to clean your shop out a bit and give me the austin

Milk - Billet crank, TA performance block, Edelbrock heads, a TON of machine and now you're spent 20 grand and may be able to out run the GTO.

I was raised in the wrong era, I guess. When you spent boatloads of money on a project, it was to be the best in whatever you were running.... now you can spend boatloads of money and not be as fast as something produced 5 years ago.

[TheSilverBuick]

I have another question,
I'm not to familiar with how fragil Buick bottom ends are, but wouldn't adding stroke allow you to make more power down low and not stress the bottom end out as much as if you had to spin it higher? But like Randall says, 15 inches, doesn't seem like a lot.

And actually once you bore it out, like .040" over, you're already at 462 or something. Unless you're going for the 494(?) kit, or is there a higher one? The 470" kit supposibly has a better rod angle for cylinder wall loading. But as you know, you can make enough power to drive over your crankshaft with 455 cid as easily as with 500cid. 600HP is where the mains on a good block supposibly get iffy. And being two bolt walking mains are supposibly a problem with rpm.

And Stiney, you should do it

[squirrel]

Put a nailhead in it. That'll get their attention. It'll still be slow, of course....and expensive to build

[SuperBuickGuy]

And actually once you bore it out, like .040" over, you're already at 462 or something. Unless you're going for the 494(?) kit, or is there a higher one? The 470" kit supposibly has a better rod angle for cylinder wall loading. But as you know, you can make enough power to drive over your crankshaft with 455 cid as easily as with 500cid. 600HP is where the mains on a good block supposibly get iffy. And being two bolt walking mains are supposibly a problem with rpm.

And Stiney, you should do it

You can solve the problem with a girdle (much can be solved with those things )

Here's the best I've come up with to build the stroker - 1/4" offset grind on the crank. 6.800 Pontiac 455 rods (Buick rods are 6.700). Gives you 494 with .030 over bore. The cost isn't too terrible, since the 6.800 is so available (it's also BBC with .001 shaved off it) and you use the "stock" pistons (stock - there are other options).... costs about ~2000 if you use all TA stuff, ~`1200 if you do it yourself.

[Thumpin455]

You guys make me feel happy to have Pontiac blocks that can take about 800hp and only start to get iffy over 700. To get 15 inches isnt really worth it to me, wont notice the difference. 455s already have lots of grunt, even though the Buick has the shortest stroke of all of them, and bigger heads and too much cam take them out of the torque range. An aftermarket Buick will set you back $20k? Geez I can build a 540 Pontiac with Tiger heads for way less than that, and those heads are $5k a set, but it would put my Formula into the 8s easily. It would be around $13k to build one of those and make over 1000hp.

The thing is what do you want to do with your Buick? I built a car capable of 9 second runs, but I cant swing all the stuff that needs updated, changed, or recertified every two years to run single digits. The car just sits even though I havent lost interest, I know what it would take to make more than a couple passes in it. I dont street race anymore, the track is 3 hours away, so why do I need a 700hp Firebird? Bragging rights only go so far, and ultimately get you nothing for it. Build the thing so its fun to drive, and go drive it.