Hp gain from N/A intercooler

[Dynoroom]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

As someone who has done it you CAN get 1 to 2 hp per every 10 degrees you lower the ambient temperature.

at what displacement? Because I know I can't do that with a 5hp Briggs, right? ;)


On the one application where we were able to bring temps well below ambient, we ran into problems lighting the fire much below 50 degrees F intake temp. This was a *high* boost, small displacement application that required higher octane fuels...

Wasn't a Briggs was it? ;D

[dieselgeek]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

As someone who has done it you CAN get 1 to 2 hp per every 10 degrees you lower the ambient temperature.

at what displacement? Because I know I can't do that with a 5hp Briggs, right? ;)


On the one application where we were able to bring temps well below ambient, we ran into problems lighting the fire much below 50 degrees F intake temp. This was a *high* boost, small displacement application that required higher octane fuels...

Wasn't a Briggs was it? ;D

Close. Pinto engine. The briggs probably breathes better ;)

[greenjunk]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

i know its great for high boost, but what about n/a

[dieselgeek]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

i know its great for high boost, but what about n/a

speaking from ZERO experience here, but I'd expect the same hp gains per CFM of airflow through the engine on an N/A application. There's just a lot less room for cooling when all you're talking about is ambient temps being cooled, versus the forced induction application where the compressor is heating the air 150-200 degrees higher than ambient...

[DanStokes]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

Dave - Remember, N2O doesn't burn, either. It supports combustion and cools the incoming charge. I'm wondering how close H2O comes to that function. No answers - just a question.

Dan

I don't understand why you would put something in the combustion chamber that doesn't burn?,
Dynoroom, how much lower than ambient can you get it?

[greenjunk]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

i'm not a chemist but when you get a water leak in the intake you don't suddenly get a hp boost.

[KeithTurk]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

evaporative cooling is something I've always found interesting... I've never played with water injection but I've heard all kinds of good things about it...

any truth out there?

K

[YELLA BRICK]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

The history of water injection....

http://www.kennedysdynotune.com/wate...er%20Injection

http://www.driven2modify.com/archive...p/t-11025.html

[greenjunk]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

If you're going through all that trouble, instead of running gas class you should run fuel class, and run alky, instead of water, then you can really add timing.

The thing is I still want to see proof that it works on an n/a motor, and that its worth the setup. All these are examples of boosted applications.

[dieselgeek]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

I'm kinda with greenjunk on this one. I know it'll work in theory, but it woudl first require that you have incredibly hot ambient temps...

Usually, when I observe the bonneville guys who spend 8 billion hours optimizing an intake or being overly super anal about one particular aspect of "making power" - I also see them missing something else totally obvious and as a result, they're still not the fastest. One example of an exception would be Dynoroom, however. He seems to have common sense PLUS the knack for crazy detailed engineering...

but for some entertaining reading, check out the landracing.com forums where guys will get into fistfights over intake manifold designs (while totally missing the boat on totally basic stuff elsewhere on their combo)

[2bbl318]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

Not sure if this on topic or not, but my dad ( who doesn't hate third party information sharing? ) once told me about someone he knew back when who put water injection on his car as it was supposed to improve mileage...? We both decided it sounded pretty hokey, but regardless, I'm very intrigued. On further reflection, it would at least in theory allow more timing advance, and possibly less pedal, (?) resulting in less fuel usage? Maybe I'm way off

[greenjunk]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

what i can say is that alky injection works extremely well on blown applications. By running it we were able to see 20hp per degree of timing added. That is substantial. Be careful though there are a lot of crappy kits that malfunction all the time. The only kit I trust is the alkycontrol stuff. Julio is the bomb, hands down.

[dieselgeek]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

Don Julio is the man, we ran prototypes of his kits on the turbo truck a few years back. We helped him develop the progressive controller. He was one of few guys back then who wouldn't give us crap about running a megasquirt (unlike a lot of other "bigname" guys)...

as for the timing advance. It's not always the case that "more timing means more power" - the whole issue with timing is that you want to have peak cylinder pressure happen around 5 degrees ATDC, and you want the pressure to stay hig as long as possible after that, pushing down on the piston. So if the water or alky injection helps you achieve that goal (ballpark) then yes, it'll make more power and can be more efficient (less pedal, as stated above) - but just make sure we're not thinking that "the more timing I can run, the more power I can make" - it's a lot more complicated than that. Banks, Volvo, and the Megasquirt guys who have run pressure sensors inside the combustion chamber, and have tested different fuels while monitoring that pressure, have released some good information on the subject.

It's the same reason there's no need to go with higher octane in the quest for "more power"

[greenjunk]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

geek i agree, There of course is a point where adding more timing will only blow your junk up. But in general on a pump gas engine we could add 5* of timing and make 100 more rwhp over an air to air only setup. our lt1 race car would make 22lbs on a 396 small block. with no air to air and a dual nozzle alky setup with c16 we were running 36* of timing with no detonation, oh i forgot to mention the 125 shot of nitrous on top of that ;D. it was badder asser

[dieselgeek]

Re: Hp gain from N/A intercooler

jeebus - you got any youtube videos of this crazy car?!?