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Rough Start Fox Mustang: Tips, Tricks, Parts, Etc.

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  • #31
    Would an underhood pic of mine help? It's a 5.8 but hooked up just like an OEM 5.0 with heat and air. I can run out and take a pic if that would be useful.

    Dan

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    • #32
      I'm not sure that the EFI style water pipes can be used with a carb intake. You may just be able to use rubber hose for you heater lines.

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      • #33
        On the Volvo (same arrangement) I replaced the steel line that runs from the front. It wasn't too pricey and was well worth it. IIRC, we got it from Rock Auto.

        Dan

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        • #34
          Pretty sure I've got it, but to double-check:

          Low port on water pump to outboard port on heater core.
          High port on water pump to thermostat housing port.
          Water port on intake manifold to inboard port on heater core.

          Only question: where does the restrictor go, the inboard port on the heater core? I believe that's correct, but at this rate there's so many layouts that it's giving me a headache.

          (seriously, who designed this shit?)
          Editor-at-Large at...well, here, of course!

          "Remy-Z, you've outdone yourself again, I thought a Mirada was the icing on the cake of rodding, but this Imperial is the spread of little 99-cent candy letters spelling out "EAT ME" on top of that cake."

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          • #35
            Inboard port line was where the factory restrictor was on my ‘86.
            Of all the paths you take in life - make sure a few of them are dirt.

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            • #36
              Oh, the joys of wiring. The engine is in the car, and I'm now working through spaghetti to get the wiring right. The sooner I get that done, the closer I am to a first-fire. I bought a Ford maintenance book, and it's been a help, but it's not the greatest. So, I'm reaching out for some help in the hopes that you can get me the quick answer.
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              This is the driver's side bundle in a car originally meant to have a 2.3L four in the engine bay. As you can see, I've figured out the coolant and oil pressure sensors, the throttle position sensor plugs, and what I'm about 90% sure is the knock sensor plug. I've also determined that the wiring that goes past the oil/water sensors and out of the picture goes to the neutral safety switch on the A4LD automatic. What I don't know is any of the rest of the plugs in this patch. I've got to figure out what goes where to get the basics of starting and charging together for the 302, and if I can keep some systems in the car happy while I do that, so be it. Anybody got information, or a four-banger Mustang that hasn't been hacked apart that could be good for photographic mapping?
              Editor-at-Large at...well, here, of course!

              "Remy-Z, you've outdone yourself again, I thought a Mirada was the icing on the cake of rodding, but this Imperial is the spread of little 99-cent candy letters spelling out "EAT ME" on top of that cake."

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              • #37
                Legal on a '89 here is "Classic car" ... they don't even tail pipe sniff them. How "Legal" (not wink wink nudge nudge) do you need?

                It's been a long time since I've been under the hood of mine and decades longer since under a 2.3 hood. I'll throw my thoughts out here anyway. Anything I say probably needs fact check verification because old is getting to me.

                off the top of my head, EEC IV 5.0's don't have knock sensors. For MAF cars they have an Idle Air control, TPS, EGR (that's what I think the bottom one may be), coolant temp, MAP, MAF, distributor and spout connectors, the injector harness, alternator, the a/c junk maybe, thermactor air bypass, thermactor air diverter (the big grey black lumps on the firewall)

                If I had to have it going by the end of the month, I would Carb it, use a chinesium HEI, forget the heater core (loop the water pump). For a carb'd setup you can lose all the heater connections and loop the water pump back to itself for the heater hose part. There is a separate hose for the intake connection. The HEI is pretty much GM on a Ford dizzy body. You need 12v to it. That's about it. The fuel pump needs to be addressed and depending on how long it has been sitting, it may be easier to buy a new tank and fuel lines. My fuel lines went solid with junk after sitting for 20 years, I'm embarrassed to say. Make sure they are clean at least (the fuel lines). It sucks to forget to do that, put a new tank in, and go HUH when you don't get any fuel out the other end.

                I'm shocked this site is still up but it will have answers to most all of your sensor / wiring questions for the 5.0 if you stay EFI. TMoss contributed HUGELY but look out for those "let's port a stock manifold" derail pages, next thing you know you are dreaming instead of driving.

                http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/


                speaking of dreaming, down the road I would look at the SN95 conversion for 5 lugs and brakes. I'd see if I could get some EBC pads for the 4 cylinder stuff and take an extra set for the "don't let perfect get in the way of done" stage you are in right now. October IS now.

                I read through here at warp speed so I may have missed it... Long tube headers, h-pipe, the 5.0 trans crossmember (double hump) and the obligatory "why the hell not" two chamber flow-bastids will drone like nuts and work.

                /yet another edit - Ford supposedly went with 4 cylinder springs for the '93 Cobra. Softer springs, bigger sway bars. It reportedly worked better at the track. Don't chunk the 4 cylinder springs, may be worth a try.
                Last edited by Beagle; July 14, 2020, 04:51 AM.
                Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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                • #38
                  The more I think about it - next up will be the front engine assembly drive. "legal" means smog pump but you said carb'd (sorry, just saw that) so I'm guessing legal has a pretty wide interpretation. With no smog pump on it, the stock belt doesn't work, and new belt / routing gets entertaining. Russel probably covered it already, and I may have pictures somewhere in the history of Bangshift on what I ended up with. Photobucket probably roached them. Underdrive pulleys make it more entertaining, as does A/C compressor or P/S removal.

                  Did you decide to go with the C6 for simplicity for this iteration? She'll be chatting around 3000 rpm at 65 with a 3.55 and 26" (stock) tire size. I don't (completely) mind getting run over on the highway, but that's 12,000 barks a minute! Assuming zero slippage, that's about right for a 108 mph trap speed in the quarter at 5k. Not many "stock" E7 302's will get 108 in the quarter, so you should be close enough for a starter.

                  thought this was worth an edit.. belt lengths change based on accessory and crank pulley size too. The difference in diameter between a Lincoln pulley and an underdrive "race" pulley is at least an inch on belt size... Point being, these are suggestions more than rule.



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                  and another edit. Sorry, I'm kind of core dumping here. If you go T5 and long tubes, make damn sure you keep the cable under control. They have a nasty habit of getting up against the header and burning.

                  Oh - and if you're thinking about underdrive pulleys and an electric fan, it can be a problem idling around. Should be fine at 3000, but idle puts the current draw v. supplied current from alternator at odds. Take a battery charger with you.
                  Last edited by Beagle; July 14, 2020, 06:43 AM.
                  Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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                  • #39
                    To your original question, have a look at the connector shapes here and see what you come up with for those two connectors? Based on what I'm seeing that may be standard across EEC IV, might get you some direction.


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                    Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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                    • #40
                      I the TPS looks more like IAC. +1 5.0 don't have knock, no clue on 2.3. Looks more like MAT.

                      I have the entire 1989 Ford passenger car wiring diagrams at home. I am a huge slacker and I need a reminder. If you can text me after the kid is in bed I can take pictures and text you back. We can do fb video call if you want to go over stuff.

                      i could be wrong but I don't think you need any of that (sensor plugs) on a carb set up. Just OP and WT for the factory gauges. Then you will need the coil power and crank?
                      ​​​​​
                      This is the ruff draft I have a PDF where I clean it up. To big to attach.

                      https://www.instagram.com/p/B8vCEhdH...=1ayxn93gpq8h0
                      Last edited by Russell; July 14, 2020, 08:13 AM.
                      http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum...-consolidation
                      1.54, 7.31 @ 94.14, 11.43 @ 118.95

                      PB 60' 1.49
                      ​​​​​​

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                      • #41
                        Russell, you're right, that is the IAC setup. Luckily, I still have the IAC so testing that was no issue. 2.3 does have knock sensor, it's towards the upper part of the intake for some reason. I'm just looking to make a stone-simple carbureted 302 run and to keep the rest of the electronics happy without going mad chopping up the wiring that's still underhood. That program wasn't fun in the Imperial and I don't want to make it a big deal in the Mustang. So, I guess what I'm really going for is, using the 1989 2.3L wiring, what do I need to connect or modify in order to make the engine run?

                        I can do a FB vid call pretty much anytime there's daylight, that won't be a problem. Once the sun goes down the flying carnivores come out and I'm a giant buffet to them.
                        Last edited by BangShift McT; July 14, 2020, 02:48 PM.
                        Editor-at-Large at...well, here, of course!

                        "Remy-Z, you've outdone yourself again, I thought a Mirada was the icing on the cake of rodding, but this Imperial is the spread of little 99-cent candy letters spelling out "EAT ME" on top of that cake."

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          There are lot of people here better to ask than me. Supper simple is:
                          1) wire on/off switch to HEI
                          2) wire push button to starter solenoid.
                          3) what alt are you using? Charging is good
                          4) what are you using for a fuel pump?

                          To use the factory key/ingnition switch I think you tie to the grey connector (Also neutral safety has to be happy). OP and WT go back through the Black connector. (On the 5.0 need to make sure the 2.3 is the same, they are just gauges not needed for making motor noises )
                          http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum...-consolidation
                          1.54, 7.31 @ 94.14, 11.43 @ 118.95

                          PB 60' 1.49
                          ​​​​​​

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                          • #43
                            For just a carb, you really only need an ignition of some sort. I have ran a Duraspark distributor, GM HEI module, TFI coil setup on the yellow truck and on the Mustang with great results. My buddy Jonathan ran one on DW14 as well. Very simple and works good.

                            Just trigger a relay with a switched 12v source and you are good to go.

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                            Life is short. Be a do'er and not a shoulda done'er.
                            1969 Galaxie 500 https://bangshift.com/forum/forum/ba...ild-it-s-alive
                            1998 Mustang GT https://bangshift.com/forum/forum/ba...60-and-a-turbo
                            1983 Mustang GT 545/552/302/Turbo302/552 http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum...485-bbr-s-83gt
                            1973 F-250 BBF Turbo Truck http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum...uck-conversion
                            1986 Ford Ranger EFI 545/C6 https://bangshift.com/forum/forum/ba...tooth-and-nail

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                            • #44
                              I think he has the Chevy style coil on cap HEI distributor.
                              http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum...-consolidation
                              1.54, 7.31 @ 94.14, 11.43 @ 118.95

                              PB 60' 1.49
                              ​​​​​​

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Russell View Post
                                I think he has the Chevy style coil on cap HEI distributor.
                                1 wire... 12v positive. Done.

                                /edit - okay, 2 wires. One for the tach, but you don't need it with the E7 cam. It'll nose over before it can hurt itself. When it quits pulling, shift.

                                /edit 2 - okay, maybe a tach. It looked like somebody needed one already from the lifter parts in the pan. My guess there is it got a new cam / lifter (probably only the one lifter) at some point in it's life. Sorry, it's rude to say it, but if the pan never came off for the missing parts, that's my guess.
                                Last edited by Beagle; July 15, 2020, 11:07 AM.
                                Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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