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The "Whatever" Project

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  • dave.g.in.gansevoort
    replied
    Yeah, ancient technology. There's a cam inside the float bowl connected to the throttle shaft that actuates a valve in there, kind of a jet sort of thing. And there's a spray bar i the center of the body between the barn doors and the vacuum actuated upper barn doors. Think about a Quadrajet and the secondary upper air valves, same function supposedly. Only lets the correct amount of air thru.

    So you jump on the accelerator, those big throttle plates open wide. The accelerator pump dumps in some raw fuel, and if calibrated right, the engine just pulls like mad.

    It was easy on methanol, a/f ratio isn't too critical as long as it's close to stoichiometry or on the rich side, up to about 4.5:1 a/f. Gasoline is a different matter. It has a narrow range for best power from just below stoichiometry say 14:1 to just around 13:1. If you monitor the a/f ratio on your modern electronically controlled engines you'll see that under a power pull, that it's typically going just slightly rich, around 14:1, as all cylinders get precisely metered fuel supply. A carbureted engine, unless it's set up with something like Webers with one throat per cylinder, may average say 13:1 at best power, but if you were to monitor each cylinder, they'd be all over the place.

    This is why Hilborns or the Rochester mechanical fuel injection systems when properly calibrated, ran better than carburetors in the early years. But look at all of the crutches the Rochester system needed, dashpots, temperature compensating devices, etc, to behave on the street. And Hilborns, changing pills between the heat races and the feature, as the temperature dropped, or other meteorological events occurred. You needed to keep a notebook with all of the variables so you didn't screw up! And things like an air density gauge and thermometer at a minimum, if you wanted to stay on top of things. Again, methanol made it a bit easier, but it might cost you a little bit of power.

    So the Predator was an attempt to make a carburetor that automatically corrected for those variables. If you got it set up for the engine correctly to begin with.

    I could go on and on and on, but I won't. I probably lost most readers somewhere around So you jump...

    Leave a comment:


  • Captain
    replied
    When I first looked at the picture......
    ​​​​​​ Thinking your shop furnace went out,
    and this appliance was what was defective looking at those SQUARE Shutters........

    So I got edumacated today on a Obscure Carburetion Device.

    Leave a comment:


  • DanStokes
    replied
    Originally posted by langleylad View Post
    Wow , there’s a blast from the past ! I forgot about those carbs
    It's a big, US version of an air valve carb like the SUs from ancient British cars. As air moves thru it (vacuum is created) it acts on a needle and seat sort of arrangement that flows more fuel. At one time they were the greatest new thing, then - EFI happened.
    Last edited by DanStokes; November 26, 2022, 08:05 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • langleylad
    replied
    Wow , there’s a blast from the past ! I forgot about those carbs

    Leave a comment:


  • dave.g.in.gansevoort
    replied
    Originally posted by DanStokes View Post
    One of the LSR tems ran them and with good success. I never messed with them and so have no opinion. Wonder if parts are still available?
    Good question. I found a website, but the last update was about a year ago. I'm going to email them to find out. But like I said, no plans for using it. It could be a good thing for a wfo application. I don't think it'd be appropriate for the street, however. Way oversized imho.

    Leave a comment:


  • DanStokes
    replied
    One of the LSR tems ran them and with good success. I never messed with them and so have no opinion. Wonder if parts are still available?

    Leave a comment:


  • dave.g.in.gansevoort
    replied
    Dug an old carburetor out of the shed today. A Predator. It'll fit on the Torquer manifold I'm going to use on the Whatever project 327, but probably not... it's rated to 900 cfm. Not really going to use it, just needed to get a couple of pictures of the thing. And I realized that it hasn't been used since the late 90s.

    Click image for larger version

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ID:	1329395 Just look at that barn door opening! As I recall, it idled okay on the 400 in Jim's hillclimb special, and throttle response was good. But it's strong suit was its ability to maintain a/f ratio climbing the mountain. Had 2 but when SCCA took over the Mt. Washington hillclimb the other one was relegated to the shelf. It was a methanol version. Unfortunately it wasn't pickled properly and residual methanol ate it. This one always had race gasoline, and was drained after each use.

    It might still work...but I don't have any plans for it.

    Leave a comment:


  • SuperBuickGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by dave.g.in.gansevoort View Post
    Crayon! They only give me one a day. And it's usually white, and the paper is white. So much white. White Christmas. White wedding... In the white room with black curtains... The white wizzard... white race cars...

    There, I got back around to cars. Always painted the 54s white. They could be fixed with rattle can paint. Appliance white. I'm told it's actually got a hint of blue to make it look whiter. When Dan and I went to his favorite automotive body work supply house in Ann Arbor, he said that fleet white would be the same. Too bad I didn't wait for Dan to spray it
    well everything was black and white in those days

    and to explain
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  • dave.g.in.gansevoort
    replied
    Originally posted by DanStokes View Post

    That one still puzzles me. I could have taught you the secrets.......
    Me too ! What was I thinking? Remember, I was doing my graduate program at the time. My brain was occupied by higher level mathematics and scientific research. And those kids I was in college with then...

    That's my story and I'm sticking to it!

    Leave a comment:


  • DanStokes
    replied
    Originally posted by dave.g.in.gansevoort View Post
    Crayon! They only give me one a day. And it's usually white, and the paper is white. So much white. White Christmas. White wedding... In the white room with black curtains... The white wizzard... white race cars...

    There, I got back around to cars. Always painted the 54s white. They could be fixed with rattle can paint. Appliance white. I'm told it's actually got a hint of blue to make it look whiter. When Dan and I went to his favorite automotive body work supply house in Ann Arbor, he said that fleet white would be the same. Too bad I didn't wait for Dan to spray it
    That one still puzzles me. I could have taught you the secrets.......

    Leave a comment:


  • dave.g.in.gansevoort
    replied
    Crayon! They only give me one a day. And it's usually white, and the paper is white. So much white. White Christmas. White wedding... In the white room with black curtains... The white wizzard... white race cars...

    There, I got back around to cars. Always painted the 54s white. They could be fixed with rattle can paint. Appliance white. I'm told it's actually got a hint of blue to make it look whiter. When Dan and I went to his favorite automotive body work supply house in Ann Arbor, he said that fleet white would be the same. Too bad I didn't wait for Dan to spray it

    Leave a comment:


  • SuperBuickGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by Captain View Post

    Well, I just found out you can't put Two Quotes into one Post.
    at least Not in This Galaxy 😃
    Originally posted by dave.g.in.gansevoort View Post

    As we know, we can't cross over our own timelines. The universe will collapse sending it into a quantum singularity anomaly. Or maybe we're already in one...

    So as we know, we can't cross over our own timelines. The universe will collapse sending it into a quantum singularity anomaly. And maybe we're already in one...

    And as we know, we can't cross over our own timelines. The universe will collapse sending it into a quantum singularity anomaly...

    Crap, we're stuck in an endless loop. Like Groundhogs Day, only worse.

    Okay, I've had enough fun for today.
    unless you're me.

    Leave a comment:


  • SuperBuickGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by dave.g.in.gansevoort View Post
    Just spent some time at the old drawing board. Nothing! I got nothing. Tomorrow back to the garage and winging it...
    did you lose your crayons?

    Leave a comment:


  • dave.g.in.gansevoort
    replied
    Just spent some time at the old drawing board. Nothing! I got nothing. Tomorrow back to the garage and winging it...

    Leave a comment:


  • dave.g.in.gansevoort
    replied
    Originally posted by Captain View Post

    Well, I just found out you can't put Two Quotes into one Post.
    at least Not in This Galaxy 😃
    As we know, we can't cross over our own timelines. The universe will collapse sending it into a quantum singularity anomaly. Or maybe we're already in one...

    So as we know, we can't cross over our own timelines. The universe will collapse sending it into a quantum singularity anomaly. And maybe we're already in one...

    And as we know, we can't cross over our own timelines. The universe will collapse sending it into a quantum singularity anomaly...

    Crap, we're stuck in an endless loop. Like Groundhogs Day, only worse.

    Okay, I've had enough fun for today.

    Leave a comment:

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