Re: In pursuit of a more badder asser van - 1974 Ford E-300 Club Wagon Chateau
Good morning, Seth!
I have quoted you above just because I wanted to tell you that I feel your words above are just that - words. I do not feel you have been honest with me. For example, "I...am putting everything else on hold until it [the van] is done". Only in the short amount of time since you made this promise, you have steadfastly broken it by continuing to work on the FireCracker. It is painfully obvious to me now that you never intended to give my van the attention and quality it deserved. Perhaps you were incapable of doing a good job? I don't know but it looks like that is the case; I will show some pictures of what I mean in a moment. In any case, this issue runs much deeper than merely lack of competence, and if you knew you couldn't do the job as promised, why didn't you turn it over to someone who could?
For over a year, you deceived me. You continued to ask for and extract vast sums of money from me without working on my van. I find it an interesting coincidence that you had time to work on the FireCracker, your Malibu, and start (and paint...) another project, the Kadett, all at the exact same time I was funneling huge sums of money to you. You never gave a thought to upholding your end of the bargain as far as the timeline was concerned, letting slip by several promised finish dates, for example the mid-May deadline you promised so I could have the van ready for my parent's golden anniversary surprise family get-together. Then you let slide another deadline of August 1. How long did you expect to drag out this project? This is another example of your lack of integrity. Additionally, the last two payments I made to you in February and March were specifically requested by you because you "needed more money" to buy parts (that I'd requested you buy at the very beginning), for example, the sway bars and disk brakes and transmission, as well as to pay Dave $900 to assemble the engine. So where are those parts that my money was supposed to be specifically allocated for? Why didn't Dave assemble the engine? Was it because you embezzled the money and didn't pay him? Or did he take the money and run?
What about the money? You chose to ignore my previous post about the discrepancy in your own accounting. I had sent you $24,700 from September to March. $200 was a gift to you to buy a camera (which you did) for you to take pictures of my van (and send me high quality photos, which you did not). So that leaves $24,500. The van cost $3200, leaving $21,300. Items outside of the scope of the van might have come to $1500, leaving $19,800. Shipping for three medium boxes to Poland for $1100? I find that hard to believe, but if you provide receipts for that, I'll believe it. Anyway, supposing for the sake of argument that it is correct, that leaves $18,700. $800 for insurance and registration? For some reason I thought we'd discussed $300 for that, but be that as it may, leaves $17,900. The DSS shortblock cost $2000. Was shipping really $500? Do you have receipts for that? Anyway, that would leave $15,400. $6100 for other engine (exhaust and cooling system included) parts? I know parts can be expensive, but without receipts, it's hard to imagine that level of expenditures. That would leave $9300. Paint and body work supplies for $3000 - once again, please provide receipts. That leaves $6300 for "labor". Remember the discrepancy I mentioned of the $1000 you forgot to mention as well as the $1100 in labor you overcharged at $25/hr instead of $20/hr? That leaves $2200 you should owe me, even by your own calculations.
So what did you do when I decided to pull the project from you? I realize this is a PM to me, but it is particularly relevant and I couldn't paraphrase better than you said it, so here goes:
"I would appreciate being compensated for the hours that I have not yet been paid for. I have 120 hours or $2400 in the van that I have not recieved payment for and since I am not completing the van I will gladly settle for less than the standard rate to expedite the process. I feel that $1000 is a fair amount to properly close out our transactions. I will have the van ready for pickup by Saturday and can send the title and bill of sale as soon as tomorrow if you are in agreement. Thank you."
So it appears that you were shaking me down for more money. What do we call this, extortion or blackmail? By your own calculations you owed me $2200, but you have the audacity to blackmail me for another $1000 so I could take delivery of the title to my van, and you would release my van to the shipper. What kind of treatment is this to a brother, friend, and fellow Bangshifter? Whatever happened to "the customer is always right" or "satisfaction guaranteed or your money back"? How do you sleep at night? Of course, though I paid the extra $1000 to get my van and title back, I did not agree to this extra charge and gave you a chance to make good on this aspect of our deal, by sending my brother a check for the any amount you thought was fair, but my brother received no money from you, which I take to mean that you think this kind of behavior is par for the course, and good service to boot!! By the way, the money I paid you for labor was contingent upon your doing a good quality job, as promised by you. I will have to have your work examined by the new builder to see exactly what kind of job you have done. So, how was I to get title to my own van without paying you another grand in ransom?
My brother sent me a list of the contents of the package:
- license plate, Michigan, with registration in Seth's name, expires May 2011
- Car bill of sale, VIN #......., made out to me, for $50 (mileage is blank), Seth signed this
- Michigan title, 1974 Ford Sta-wagon, same VIN #, filled in for sale to me for $50, mileage is blank, Seth signed this.
- Sales receipt, diversified creations, 12/2/2009, $2795.05
- sales recept, diversified creations, 11/24/2009, 136.69
- sales receipt,, summit racing equipment, 1/15/10, no total, but several hundred dollars
- sales receipt, summit, 3/11/10, about $500
- receipt, GNE paint centers, 10/13/2009 $271
- summit receipt, 11/17/09, about $700
- summit receipt, 1/21/10, 6.95
- receipt, performance line tool center, 9/25/09, $230
- Autozone receipt, 10/20/09, $166
This totals just over $5000, and I assume it does not include the short block for $2000, nor some engine parts. So we can safely say the parts here represent $7000 plus some additional amount I am not privy to.
Now we can turn to the quality of the work that you promised, and what I see from pictures taken on location at Dave's shop prior to removal of the van, and at the new builder's location. First of all, you made a promise that there would be no rust on the van after you got done with it. Even in this thread when I asked if you had properly sealed the area around the gas tank, you assured me it had been done. So please explain to me why I see rust on the straps holding up the gas tank. How can this be properly repaired without removing the gas tank again and painting those straps?! How hard would it have been to paint the straps prior to installation of the van?
The right rear corner sheetmetal is done incorrectly; you can see by the shadow that the line is far from straight near the bottom.
Here are some pictures from the new builder. It appears that a lot of the stainless body trim is mangled. How in the hell did this happen? Even the very rare front hood piece which I had sent to you from California is twisted beyond redemption. How did this happen? It was in perfect condition when you received it. How did the other trim get so messed up? Do you have any idea how hard it is to find replacements for this trim?! The builder also noticed some shoddy workmanship, uneven welding lines in the patch panels, unfinished work along the bottom of the rocker panels, etc, ad. inf. This will have to be taken down to bare metal to see the extent of the damage, and repaired properly.
rare but now mangled hood trim piece:
rulers don't lie:
Again, how much should I have to pay for the work you performed on my van? I gave you nearly $20,000 (not including the cost of the van itself or other items or shipping for them, etc) for labor and parts. How much should I have to pay for some shoddy bodywork (340 hours worth) and some new engine parts? Do you think this reflects positively on you, and other teams and communities you associate with? I don't have to be your friend (though I'm open to friendship with everyone till they do me wrong), but I do expect fairness and respect. Is this how you treat and respect people? Just wondering, though I have ample evidence in front of me from our year of working together. I wish you well, Seth, and will keep you in my prayers. Since you're an ordained minister, no doubt you will appreciate that.
This project was supposed to be fun. It was supposed to be a way for me to provide my young sons with exposure to a cool van and the vanning experience. Unfortunately it has turned into the greatest and most expensive fiasco in my life. Thus, I have decided to christen the van with a new name, The Money Pit.
Originally posted by fahrenschnell
I have quoted you above just because I wanted to tell you that I feel your words above are just that - words. I do not feel you have been honest with me. For example, "I...am putting everything else on hold until it [the van] is done". Only in the short amount of time since you made this promise, you have steadfastly broken it by continuing to work on the FireCracker. It is painfully obvious to me now that you never intended to give my van the attention and quality it deserved. Perhaps you were incapable of doing a good job? I don't know but it looks like that is the case; I will show some pictures of what I mean in a moment. In any case, this issue runs much deeper than merely lack of competence, and if you knew you couldn't do the job as promised, why didn't you turn it over to someone who could?
For over a year, you deceived me. You continued to ask for and extract vast sums of money from me without working on my van. I find it an interesting coincidence that you had time to work on the FireCracker, your Malibu, and start (and paint...) another project, the Kadett, all at the exact same time I was funneling huge sums of money to you. You never gave a thought to upholding your end of the bargain as far as the timeline was concerned, letting slip by several promised finish dates, for example the mid-May deadline you promised so I could have the van ready for my parent's golden anniversary surprise family get-together. Then you let slide another deadline of August 1. How long did you expect to drag out this project? This is another example of your lack of integrity. Additionally, the last two payments I made to you in February and March were specifically requested by you because you "needed more money" to buy parts (that I'd requested you buy at the very beginning), for example, the sway bars and disk brakes and transmission, as well as to pay Dave $900 to assemble the engine. So where are those parts that my money was supposed to be specifically allocated for? Why didn't Dave assemble the engine? Was it because you embezzled the money and didn't pay him? Or did he take the money and run?
What about the money? You chose to ignore my previous post about the discrepancy in your own accounting. I had sent you $24,700 from September to March. $200 was a gift to you to buy a camera (which you did) for you to take pictures of my van (and send me high quality photos, which you did not). So that leaves $24,500. The van cost $3200, leaving $21,300. Items outside of the scope of the van might have come to $1500, leaving $19,800. Shipping for three medium boxes to Poland for $1100? I find that hard to believe, but if you provide receipts for that, I'll believe it. Anyway, supposing for the sake of argument that it is correct, that leaves $18,700. $800 for insurance and registration? For some reason I thought we'd discussed $300 for that, but be that as it may, leaves $17,900. The DSS shortblock cost $2000. Was shipping really $500? Do you have receipts for that? Anyway, that would leave $15,400. $6100 for other engine (exhaust and cooling system included) parts? I know parts can be expensive, but without receipts, it's hard to imagine that level of expenditures. That would leave $9300. Paint and body work supplies for $3000 - once again, please provide receipts. That leaves $6300 for "labor". Remember the discrepancy I mentioned of the $1000 you forgot to mention as well as the $1100 in labor you overcharged at $25/hr instead of $20/hr? That leaves $2200 you should owe me, even by your own calculations.
So what did you do when I decided to pull the project from you? I realize this is a PM to me, but it is particularly relevant and I couldn't paraphrase better than you said it, so here goes:
"I would appreciate being compensated for the hours that I have not yet been paid for. I have 120 hours or $2400 in the van that I have not recieved payment for and since I am not completing the van I will gladly settle for less than the standard rate to expedite the process. I feel that $1000 is a fair amount to properly close out our transactions. I will have the van ready for pickup by Saturday and can send the title and bill of sale as soon as tomorrow if you are in agreement. Thank you."
So it appears that you were shaking me down for more money. What do we call this, extortion or blackmail? By your own calculations you owed me $2200, but you have the audacity to blackmail me for another $1000 so I could take delivery of the title to my van, and you would release my van to the shipper. What kind of treatment is this to a brother, friend, and fellow Bangshifter? Whatever happened to "the customer is always right" or "satisfaction guaranteed or your money back"? How do you sleep at night? Of course, though I paid the extra $1000 to get my van and title back, I did not agree to this extra charge and gave you a chance to make good on this aspect of our deal, by sending my brother a check for the any amount you thought was fair, but my brother received no money from you, which I take to mean that you think this kind of behavior is par for the course, and good service to boot!! By the way, the money I paid you for labor was contingent upon your doing a good quality job, as promised by you. I will have to have your work examined by the new builder to see exactly what kind of job you have done. So, how was I to get title to my own van without paying you another grand in ransom?
My brother sent me a list of the contents of the package:
- license plate, Michigan, with registration in Seth's name, expires May 2011
- Car bill of sale, VIN #......., made out to me, for $50 (mileage is blank), Seth signed this
- Michigan title, 1974 Ford Sta-wagon, same VIN #, filled in for sale to me for $50, mileage is blank, Seth signed this.
- Sales receipt, diversified creations, 12/2/2009, $2795.05
- sales recept, diversified creations, 11/24/2009, 136.69
- sales receipt,, summit racing equipment, 1/15/10, no total, but several hundred dollars
- sales receipt, summit, 3/11/10, about $500
- receipt, GNE paint centers, 10/13/2009 $271
- summit receipt, 11/17/09, about $700
- summit receipt, 1/21/10, 6.95
- receipt, performance line tool center, 9/25/09, $230
- Autozone receipt, 10/20/09, $166
This totals just over $5000, and I assume it does not include the short block for $2000, nor some engine parts. So we can safely say the parts here represent $7000 plus some additional amount I am not privy to.
Now we can turn to the quality of the work that you promised, and what I see from pictures taken on location at Dave's shop prior to removal of the van, and at the new builder's location. First of all, you made a promise that there would be no rust on the van after you got done with it. Even in this thread when I asked if you had properly sealed the area around the gas tank, you assured me it had been done. So please explain to me why I see rust on the straps holding up the gas tank. How can this be properly repaired without removing the gas tank again and painting those straps?! How hard would it have been to paint the straps prior to installation of the van?
The right rear corner sheetmetal is done incorrectly; you can see by the shadow that the line is far from straight near the bottom.
Here are some pictures from the new builder. It appears that a lot of the stainless body trim is mangled. How in the hell did this happen? Even the very rare front hood piece which I had sent to you from California is twisted beyond redemption. How did this happen? It was in perfect condition when you received it. How did the other trim get so messed up? Do you have any idea how hard it is to find replacements for this trim?! The builder also noticed some shoddy workmanship, uneven welding lines in the patch panels, unfinished work along the bottom of the rocker panels, etc, ad. inf. This will have to be taken down to bare metal to see the extent of the damage, and repaired properly.
rare but now mangled hood trim piece:
rulers don't lie:
Again, how much should I have to pay for the work you performed on my van? I gave you nearly $20,000 (not including the cost of the van itself or other items or shipping for them, etc) for labor and parts. How much should I have to pay for some shoddy bodywork (340 hours worth) and some new engine parts? Do you think this reflects positively on you, and other teams and communities you associate with? I don't have to be your friend (though I'm open to friendship with everyone till they do me wrong), but I do expect fairness and respect. Is this how you treat and respect people? Just wondering, though I have ample evidence in front of me from our year of working together. I wish you well, Seth, and will keep you in my prayers. Since you're an ordained minister, no doubt you will appreciate that.
This project was supposed to be fun. It was supposed to be a way for me to provide my young sons with exposure to a cool van and the vanning experience. Unfortunately it has turned into the greatest and most expensive fiasco in my life. Thus, I have decided to christen the van with a new name, The Money Pit.
Comment