BBR's 83GT - 552 BBF version 3.0 (at least)

[DanStokes]

I've been lucky enough to have a shop for the past 35 years or so, even when I got my own place following divorce #2. They have all had heat and the last 2 had at least marginal AC. The last 2 have also had a hoist, which at my age is NOT a luxury if I'm going to do this stuff. They have all been too small but I can't imagine having one that is too big! So yeah, I agree with Jim - shop is good. Check in with us for ideas of what is necessary and what can wait. Many of us have traveled around this block and have real-world experience. Speaking of which, where's Nick?

Dan

[cantvalve16]

BBR, what about a twist on your current combo. Seems like you don't want to go any faster, but what if you could do it more reliably and with better mileage? Maybe your same long block with a milder cam set up to make mean torque right from idle. Some taller gears and a milder converter to get your road manners and mileage up and lower compression from a dished piston. Now, add your turbo and maybe injection. Nothing crazy with boost, just something to make up the power difference from the loss of gear and converter and give you the ol' freight train feel in the second half of the track. Not to mention that your power could really come in hard later down the track once you are hooked and movin'. Just another perspective.

[SuperBuickGuy]

I get the enjoy it as is - I have the flares, the motor, the wheels... but I refuse to pull the Corvette apart and build it up into v2.0 because I love that stupid, simplistic thing.

With that said, projects do tend to start to build up once you have a place to keep them out of the weather (including the storming wife)

[Orange65]

#2 Valve head.


#8 piston. The small chunk of valve was in here bouncing around. Note the big dent in the piston at the 6 o'clock position. There is a corresponding dent in the cylinder wall about 3/4" down. It is prob. 0.030" deep, so that cylinder is toast.


#8 head. Easily fixable. Might need a new seat. I have not pulled the valves to check.


#2 piston. Pretty beat up, but cylinder wall looks ok.


#2 head. Pretty beat up as well. Chamber will probably clean up, but the seat and guide will likely need to be replaced.


The culprit. Just this tiny amount of interference will eventually kill a valve. This is not where I was expecting to see a valve mark at all. Like I said before, it was not enough interference to notice when rotating the engine over, so I didn't have a clue it was happening. When I built this engine I had a crap ton of P2V clearance, so I didn't bother to check anything. The additional duration, lift and advance all added up to bring that crap ton to a negative value. Totally my mistake for not checking.


So. Where do we go from here? That seems to be the question that is burning in everyone's minds at this point. Of course, the cost of each option is a huge factor. Current list of options:

1. Pull engine, order 2 pistons and a set of rings and rod bearings, sleeve block (different machine shop this time), fix head and put it back like it was with the old camshaft.

2. Pull engine, order 2 pistons and a set of rings and rod bearings, sleeve block (different machine shop this time), fix head and change cam to a hyd ft and never worry about solid roller lifters any more. lol

3. Buy a running EFI 460 from a local yard (already located one - $500), use the short block in the Mustang, swap to a bigger hyd ft cam, fix heads, save the EFI stuff to use on the pickup. Essentially killing 2 birds with 1 stone. Car would definitely be slower, but with the smaller, milder engine, I might be more inclined to drive it and enjoy it more.

4. Go off the wall, sell off all the BBF stuff and swap in a 5.7L hemi and A518 O/D trans. This actually sounds like the most fun since winter is fast approaching, but is certainly not the lowest cost method and would definitely require selling parts to fund it. (Currently there's a 5.7L on CL here for 900 and an A518 for 650).

Been really thinking A LOT about turbochargers lately and the current engine package is not conducive to adding any sort of forced induction. Static compression is just too high and it would need a huge turbo to work properly. Plus 10.00 is as quick as I really need to go and a turbo'd 545 would have the potential to eclipse that by a significant margin. If I wanted to turbo something, an S480 blowing a stock bottom end 460 (10-12 psi) or a stock 5.7L Hemi would probably make enough power to run mid/low-10's up here and still be plenty mild mannered on the street.

Anyway, that's where I'm at.

It's a mustang- doesn't that mean you have to put a junkyard 5.3 LS in it?

Seriously, if all you are concerned about is power, a 5.3 + ebay turbos should do better than your current combo. Or if you are interested in Mopar- why not a 440? I see them on Craigslist around here occasionally for next to nothing. 440 + turbos gets my vote.

[BBR]

While I am a huge fan of Big Mopars, (external oil pump, dry intake, drop out water pump, etc) and actually entertained (and researched) the idea of putting one in this car at one point, I don't think I want to go that route now. LS engines are neat, but I really do not want one in my car.

I have considered going to a hydraulic roller and even a hydraulic flat tappet cam, but they still have to be rather large to kill off cylinder pressure and keep it pump gas friendly with the current short block. The largest hyd FT I have found is still well over 200psi cranking pressure on Wallace Racing's dynamic compression calculator so that would be iffy.

Biggest thing is I don't want to spend a ton of money on it right now. Switching pistons ($600+) would require the crank to be rebalanced as well. I liked the Herbert cam that was in it and if backing the Lunati up 4 degrees to straight up (cam is ground with 4 degrees of advance) does not fix the P2V clearance, I will just stab Herby back in and enjoy it.

[cstmwgn]

The pistons looked like Probes - is the upper ring land and crown thick enough to tolerate sinking the valve reliefs another .060 - .080? I don't believe that would hurt the balance enough to warrant re-balancing the rotating assembly.

[Beagle]

I was pretty fond of it like it was. lol I am leaning towards getting it back to where it was, and then begin collecting parts for the next phase. I will be building a shop next year, so fixing what I have fits that timeline better.

1 vote shop!!

and a mill and a lathe and a lift and and and... dang, you'd be dangerous. I like the BBF because it is blunt force trauma and because it just keeps getting better, but you would do the same thing from anything you put in it.

[BBR]

The pistons looked like Probes - is the upper ring land and crown thick enough to tolerate sinking the valve reliefs another .060 - .080? I don't believe that would hurt the balance enough to warrant re-balancing the rotating assembly.

I bet they are. I have almost talked myself into just poking the Herbert cam back in and calling it good. It was a good running combo.

[BBR]

I have all but decided to just ditch the big block and move on to new more interesting stuff. With winter approaching, I just can't justify spending the money to fix this engine when the car will most likely just sit for several months and if it is running, I would not be motivated to do much of anything. I have not completely decided what I am going to do, but have been researching the Gen3 hemi stuff A WHOLE LOT. Throw in a 4L80E transmission and I have the potential to piss off everybody, regardless of their brand loyalty. haha.

The Gen 3 motor engine mount bosses look to be like they are very close to where BBF engine mount bosses are. Might just be able to figure out a quick and dirty way to swap one into a fox chassis.....

[Deaf Bob]

I will admit I never thought I would love a small block in a derby car after running 455 Buicks and 500 caddies.. But these 2 we run, especially the one set up for E-85 just blow me away every time.. The big blocks have to be worked hard and fast to get it done before they quit because they are overheated too far.. The small blocks seem to take their time getting hot.. Whatever you choose will be interesting.. You will most likely eventually get to where you are now with the big block...I'm not saying breakage wise.. Big blocks are nice, small blocks can be pretty sweet too!

[squirrel]

there was a modern Challenger at the local dyno day Saturday...stockish 5.7 made 380 hp at the wheels, which was substantially more than my carb'd 454. Neat motors, I think you should do it. I did a little reading up on what it takes to put one in something like a yellow 70 Dart swinger, and it looks like a lot of work (and some coin). But it should be easier to put it in a Ford, right? especially one that has enough room for a big block already.

[BBR]

I don't think it will be too tough to fit one in a Fox. I've already done some measuring and it looks like one would fit very nicely in there. The 4l80e would be easier to source than an A518 and will have a larger aftermarket to choose parts from. There are manual shift boxes that are available that essentially turns them into a manual valve body transmission. Pretty neat stuff. The stock cylinder heads are fantastic. They move more as much or more air than my big block Trick Flow heads do. Ray Meyers has run 10.08 in his Barracuda with his Gen3. His car weights just under 3200lbs and runs a 3.55 gear. That's in very good East coast air, but if I can screw together a similar combo and still run in the 10's here I'll be pretty freakin happy.

[squirrel]

what do you think your car would weigh with that motor and trans? the trans is kind of heavy...the motor is kind of light, isnt it?

[BBR]

4l80e and the c6 weight pretty much the same ~ 175 lbs w/o converter. The G3 hemi in drag pack trim (carb style intake, motor plate, etc ) weights about 200 lbs less than my BBF. So the car would end up being around 3000lbs with waaaaaaaay less weight up front. This is a good thing.

[Deaf Bob]

Better F/R bias!