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Hillbilly Hauler, or.. my first diesel

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  • I an surprised it's worse than the old one, I guess the extra power and less emissions use more fuel
    http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum...-consolidation

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    • Originally posted by Russell View Post
      I an surprised it's worse than the old one, I guess the extra power and less emissions use more fuel
      it's heavier, taller, has 3.73 instead of 3.55, and has a lot more emissions...The Diesel Particulate Filter uses extra fuel to burn out particles from the trash can sized particulate filter every 100-200 miles. Not good for #7 or #8 I'm finding out (not personally, just horror stories). They can be removed and tuned out but that opens a can of worms. I'm not real sure I'm not going to look for a bulletproofed 6.0, who knows.
      Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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      • So yours doesn't use DPF? BTW - I'm named on the patent (way down at the bottom in fine print) for the fuel method of regenerating the DPF. I know from extensive dyno work that if it's working properly the FE hit is 2 to 3% - if it's sucking up lots of fuel it isn't right. Dealers often pass it off as "that dame DPF" when really they don't have the knowhow to properly diagnose and fix it. I don't have specific info on the Ford system as to what's out of whack but SOMETHING is.

        Dan

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        • Originally posted by JWS4621 View Post
          You will miss the simplicity of the 7.3. I looked for a long time before I bought mine. It is huge, smelly and hard to park but I like it.
          No kidding... P0231 = no crank. You're up against it without a scanner with this new junk. Swapped the backup light relay with the fuel pump relay and it's going again. The current high paying job has me looking at new stuff with a warranty. lol. I think I'm on borrowed time with the fuel pump (inline lift pump, not the bucks up take the cab off to replace one). I've got more tolerance for a work vehicle than I used to. I'm surprised I didn't drive it over to the dealership and trade keys. I'll let it have one f* up I guess. The problem with the 2016 (besides only having 860 foot pounds of torque) is in addition to the DPF, now they want you to fill up a tank with urine... errr... urea (DEF) all the time.

          I don't pull a trailer that much. The new 2.7 twin turbo F150 is kind of a hoot and the one I have my eye on at the moment has 3.73's so it will pull 9000 pounds according to "them". I think they fudged the HP numbers on that truck. The short cab I drove felt like a mid 14 second truck, which borders on amusing. We'll see if I do that or fix the front end in the red truck one more time and sell the new one. We're having a tough time bonding.
          Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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          • Originally posted by DanStokes View Post
            So yours doesn't use DPF? BTW - I'm named on the patent (way down at the bottom in fine print) for the fuel method of regenerating the DPF. I know from extensive dyno work that if it's working properly the FE hit is 2 to 3% - if it's sucking up lots of fuel it isn't right. Dealers often pass it off as "that dame DPF" when really they don't have the knowhow to properly diagnose and fix it. I don't have specific info on the Ford system as to what's out of whack but SOMETHING is.

            Dan
            I don't think I saw this post before. Hmmm. Notification is not what it used to be.

            I used to like you Dan. lol. So washing down two cylinders with diesel to burn the crap off of the honey comb filter was your idea? Ford actually has a recalibration campaign for "Flames coming out of the exhaust" because they were dumping a little too much fuel down the pipe.
            Last edited by Beagle; December 7, 2016, 05:21 PM.
            Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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            • Beags, let me say again that if you're "washing down two cylinders with Diesel" something's WAY out of whack. Our development mule used a separate injector in the exhaust stream just ahead of the DPF and that worked great and we had full control. We also drove the engine rich instead that that worked OK, too. I suppose Ford (and others) went that way to avoid the extra injector.

              Dan

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              • I'm just giving you grief, but I look at diesel particulate filters the same way I look at pellet catalytic converters right now. It does impact the fuel economy significantly according to the highly inaccurate lie-o-meter MPG gauge on the dash, like 15-20% that is hard to recover from. Likewise, there are a wealth of 6.4 owners who didn't see the legendary diesel engine longevity and the DPF regeneration strategy looks like the major contributor. An injector on the pipe would likely be a far better solution from a metering standpoint. It definitely sounds like a better idea than running two cylinders so rich that flames shoot out the tail pipe. I'm guessing it would be a plumbing nightmare on a common rail diesel and a programming nightmare unless you ran a completely independent controller for that injector.

                In reality, I don't "need" 950 foot pounds like the 2017's make but boy does it get addictive fast when you stomp on the loud pedal. I've given serious thought to a 6.2 powered gasoline burner which still makes more nuts than I really need for the job I have the truck doing. We all know how indecisive I can get when it comes to selecting a powerplant... and the fact than a RWD work truck F250 drives and drives marginally better then a Connestoga wagon has me wondering if it's time to downsize. A plastic bed liner in an F150 would fix my angst about the aluminum bed floor (so would a sheet of plywood... lol.) and after driving one, I'm pretty sure I could still get speeding tickets pretty easy dragging a car trailer. The 2.7 twin turbo is amazingly good.

                I hope I don't make you guys as crazy as I do everyone around me when it's time for a new anything but really cheap vehicle. I find reasons to love whatever it is I'm looking at but always find one glaring reason why I hate it that makes it really difficult to just buy something and not worry about it. In the long run, that reason is usually money. I have a serious issue with paying as much for a truck as I did for my first house... it paralyzes my check writing hand it's so bad. I don't have as big a problem paying twice as much for a new truck as I did for my first new truck 30 years ago, but six times as much just hurts my skull. Even if I probably make more than six times as much now as I did then, it just hurts. That's the strategy "they" use on you to keep you perpetually broke. You make more now, so spend more now. No. Next question.

                In sitting here thinking about it some more, I think I'll have the front end rebuilt on the red one and just work some overtime. Most of the stuff I need to do the job like a press and big air guns are not at this house. Then I can trade the newer truck for a F150 with a warranty and keep a diesel that doesn't seem to mind when you beat on it or get it filthy dirty.
                Last edited by Beagle; December 8, 2016, 05:03 AM.
                Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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                • My cousin had an ecoboost he said he didn't like it for pulling a trailer, got horrible mileage. Something messed up on the truck while it was in the shop he traded it for a v8 f150
                  Last edited by Russell; December 8, 2016, 06:50 AM.
                  http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum...-consolidation

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                  • Interesting ... I noticed a little turbo lag on the 2.7, but I figured 3.73's would help with that. Most of them have 3.31's and I consider that a city truck ratio. I've been driving a 4cyl Escape mostly, about 18k miles since February, so any of them are going to feel like a rocketship in comparison. The point of that comment is I tend to anticipate things like hills and drive accordingly. The fuel economy on this newer truck has been really disappointing, but I'm not sure I'm done trying to improve that. I haven't quite rubbed the new off of the "good lord this thing makes some torque" accelerator position. Haha.
                    With only a few thousand miles on it, fuel costs are trivial compared to the price of a new truck. There's a drawback for everything.. better economy, fatass payment. lol.

                    I usually bond with a vehicle, but this white thing is fighting it. Apparently I'm going to have to learn about alignments, this one doesn't have sloppy steering but it won't stay in a lane either. You constantly have to give it input. On the plus side, man does it start easy when it's cold, something I can't say about my 7.3.

                    Back to the current most irritating quality, the road wandering. Is this a product of camber? I saw where you can get adjustable caster/camber bushings for this truck, and I'm wondering if that might be the cure to it's ills.
                    Last edited by Beagle; December 9, 2016, 05:20 AM.
                    Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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                    • bushings are more likely the culprit
                      Doing it all wrong since 1966

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                      • Originally posted by SuperBuickGuy View Post
                        bushings are more likely the culprit
                        x2 And when replacing them, get the OEM ones. Cheap rubber replacements have a life of about 5000 miles, and Urethane is even worse.

                        Radius arm twin i-beam front suspension? Ford is STILL using that horrific design on the new trucks? Unreal....

                        Wild camber changes and toe-setting changes within a small suspension travel distance are the hallmarks of this design. You set it at what is guessed to be normal ride height and every little dip in the road changes it by several degrees.

                        Herding cats.




                        Of all the paths you take in life - make sure a few of them are dirt.

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                        • While we like Vanna the Van ('99 E150) it too wanders even though it's low mileage and we've replaced a bunch of stuff up front. Vic (our Vic and owner of Allen's Garage in Fancy Gap, VA) says that Ford trucks simply don't stay in their lane like my Dodge does (the Dodge has a ton of caster). So it's worth making sure that everything is in perfect shape but also to accept that you'll probably have to utilize the steering input device constantly.

                          Dan

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                          • post 2006 I believe the twin i beam was dead - much improved dynamics and much tighter turning radius - and coil springs up front.

                            I miss my 7.3 when I'm towing - but not when it's cold out!

                            New diesels are amazingly quiet powerful, and quick to start when cold - but at the same time horrifically complex and ridonkulously expensive.

                            If I get another diesel, it will most likely be a 7.3 or a 6.4.

                            For now the '91 F150 SC 8ft 351w with 3.55 traction lock is doing everything I need it to, it's parked more often than not - and it gets what it gets for fuel economy, the registration and insurance is so much cheaper than the newer trucks - I'd still be money ahead if the fuel economy was 1/3 of a new one!
                            There's always something new to learn.

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                            • It's a RWD F250 Super Duty. Yep, the same 50+ year old design they are still using in 2017. The F150's went to a-arms in 97 iirc, as was the two year light duty F250 (97-98). I wonder if they may have changed something in the geometry for fuel economy or something as none of the other 5 I have prior to this one needed as much attention. Maybe they were wore out just right or something. Pffft.

                              I was reading a guys thread on a Bronco forum where he went through a pile of shims to get it to drive the way he wanted. The aftermarket has an adjustable camber/caster bushing for this truck , I was thinking about giving it a try before giving up on the truck. Seems like the Wine and Cheese magazines still complain about this on brand new trucks (Car and Driver, Motor Trend) so I'm guessing Dan may be right and I may have to drive it that way (Right into a dealership).
                              Last edited by Beagle; December 10, 2016, 07:04 AM.
                              Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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                              • And in the end, I guess I really I wanted a new four slice toaster.. the newest one here has 130,000 slices of toast on it and it shows, so I bought a new one in black. I probably should have done this instead of the white F250 to begin with since I will keep the red F250 no matter what.


                                Flying south, with a flock of bird dogs.

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