Starting problems on my 65 Vette

[kolsen911]

When I turn the key on the electric fuel pump comes on. Sometimes, not always, when I turn the key to start, everything dies. About 30-60 secs later the fuel pump will start back up. The wiring diagram shows the start circuit goes thru the horn relay so one time when it died I tried the horn and all I got was a little squeak. After sitting awhile I went back out and it started right up, no problem. Brand new 1000 CCA battery that I cleaned the contacts with wire cleaner. I bought some star washers so my next step will be to use them on the wiring starting with the starter.

Anyone have an idea??

[squirrel]

get a test light, use it when the car is not starting. Intermittents are fun, eh?

But a thorough inspection of all wiring connections in the starting circuit might be a good place to start. Star washers are usually not required if everything is clean and tight.

[Dan Barlow]

While we have two vettes in the household and they are the 2nd ajs 3rd ones , I definitely am not a vette expert but I would check to make sure all your ground wires are all connected .

[oletrux4evr]

Squirrel and Dan are both right.......check it all, especially the grounds.

[anotheridiot]

If it is stock wiring, I am thinking that the starter solenoid is used for the battery power to most of the engine. You usually have a run position on the solenoid and a start position and that is where most problems start. Your solenoid or starter motor might be starting to get a bad spot where it takes more amps to get it to turn and it takes away from the rest of the circuit.
First thing I always do is find a new place for the run wire to come from to eliminate the solenoid, in the darkest, dirtiest, hottest location on the car to simply do one job and engage the gear for the starter motor.

[fatguyzinc]

unbolt the "pass thru" for the wiring harness to fuse box under the brake booster on firewall
and spooge a HUGE amount of dielectric grease everywhere then put it back. really really
common on older vettes, we have 2 now and 3 more previously that all needed that, and
several more friends cars/custmers cars too.

[dieselhead]

spooge a HUGE amount of dielectric grease everywhere then put it back.

Why everywhere? Around the edges of the connecting block is a good idea to keep moisture out after cleaning the electrical contacts but not on the contacts themselves. Dielectric means nonconductive and they make conductive grease for electrical contacts. I hear people say all the time that dielectric grease cured their electrical problems but what cured their problems is that they cleaned the contact surfaces. Most of the dielectric grease is squeezed out when the connection is tightened. I was an electrician/electronic technician for a long time and if you got caught using dielectric grease on any electrical connection you would get fired immediately. Then somebody had to go back and clean the dielectric grease of all the connections you had made.

[SuperBuickGuy]

the starter switch is the only thing I can think of which could cause that problem... if the contacts inside the switch are worn/corroded, that would be the result....

[Monster]

If it is stock wiring ...

The first clue that this is not the case is the opening sentence;

When I turn the key on the electric fuel pump comes on.

[fatguyzinc]

Why everywhere? Around the edges of the connecting block is a good idea to keep moisture out after cleaning the electrical contacts but not on the contacts themselves. Dielectric means nonconductive and they make conductive grease for electrical contacts. I hear people say all the time that dielectric grease cured their electrical problems but what cured their problems is that they cleaned the contact surfaces. Most of the dielectric grease is squeezed out when the connection is tightened. I was an electrician/electronic technician for a long time and if you got caught using dielectric grease on any electrical connection you would get fired immediately. Then somebody had to go back and clean the dielectric grease of all the connections you had made.

the non conductive grease helps keep circuits from bleeding over into each other?
i dunno, man--im just telling him what worked for ME and many friends/customers
with C1-C2-C3 vettes. how many vettes did you say you owned again?

commercial electronics is a bit different from auto electronics in many ways...

and if im wrong im wrong but it sure worked on all the vettes i did it on. and
the guy that told ME that "wrong trick" was 70yrs old and owned the ONLY
covette specialty shop on the island. has worked great for ME so far. the OP dont
HAVE to take my advice.....

[anotheridiot]

The first clue that this is not the case is the opening sentence;

I dont understand. He says the wiring includes the horn relay. All stock wiring has the fuel pump relay click at the on position.Hell, we use that to prime the fuel system after a car sits for a long time. There are circuits that need the full 12 volts to work, or 11.5 minimum and there seems to be a huge drain when the key goes to the start position.

[dieselhead]

"commercial electronics is a bit different from auto electronics in many ways..."

What are some of those many ways? I've never owned a Corvette (don't like plastic cars) but electronic problems (and theory) are the same no matter where they occur. The copper connections in older vehicles will degrade over time so the older the vehicle the more electrical problems there will be. When you unplugged the Corvette connectors and plugged them back you actually cleaned the copper contacts a little. There is some stuff called STABILANT 22 that is supposed to repair the electric contact surfaces in old vehicles. I have some but haven't tried it yet because I don't have electrical problems right now.

"the non conductive grease helps keep circuits from bleeding over into each other?"

Not really. The plastic between the copper connections won't allow any electricity to bleed over to adjacent connections but moisture and dirt will. Dielectric grease is designed to keep moisture out and make disassembly easier (like spark plug boots). If you get a little conductive grease between adjacent connections it won't conduct enough electricity to measure and won't short out any 12 volt DC circuit.


"the guy that told ME that "wrong trick" was 70yrs old and owned the ONLY
covette specialty shop on the island"

I've been working on commercial electronics as an occupation and on automotive electronics as a hobby since when I was 17. I'm 76 now and still doing automotive work as a hobby. I also do all the home electrical repair for myself and friends but what do I know? I don't care what you do, just telling you the facts.

[SuperBuickGuy]

I dont understand. He says the wiring includes the horn relay. All stock wiring has the fuel pump relay click at the on position.Hell, we use that to prime the fuel system after a car sits for a long time. There are circuits that need the full 12 volts to work, or 11.5 minimum and there seems to be a huge drain when the key goes to the start position.

In a 1965 Corvette.... please post of a picture of this electric fuel pump relay in a 1965 Corvette so the rest of us can learn....

[squirrel]

I wonder if the OP got his car running, while we were all arguing about it?

No factory electric pump or relay. The horn relay is used as a common power wiring point, the power doesn't actually go "through" this relay, it only connects to it. Only the power to the horn goes "through" this relay.

The electric pump going on when you turn the key on, then it shuts off after two seconds, is an EFI thing that GM and others used starting around 1980 when they began using EFI on many cars. This car probably just has the pump wired directly to the ignition circuit, so when you turn on the key, the pump starts running.

but if there is a bad wiring connection somewhere that is intermittent, it will work some times under some conditions, but not under others. A bad battery will do this, a dirty or loose connection at the battery cable or the horn relay in this case, or at that bulkhead connector, or any of several other places, will do it. The ignition switch having burned contacts or a loose connection might also do it.

I don't know what it's like in Oregon or on a Pacific island, but my guess is that there is more trouble with electrical connections getting corroded, than we have here in AZ. So cleaning things carefully and giving them a coating of grease might be a good plan.

[anotheridiot]

In a 1965 Corvette.... please post of a picture of this electric fuel pump relay in a 1965 Corvette so the rest of us can learn....

Well, if you feel that is necessary, I am sure the stock wiring on anything includes getting power to the ignition coil thru the run circuit on the solenoid on the starter. So if someone is going to put an aftermarket electric fuel pump on anything they will most likely tap in at that point.

I really did not think that had to be explained to you experts. I am sure there are guys running 55 Chevys that way too.