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  • 68scott385
    replied
    Originally posted by SpiderGearsMan View Post
    why olds ?
    I knew somebody would eventually ask that question. I will give an answer as best I can in a day or two, and make you read your butt off for it. BWAHhahahahaha

    If you guys like long, agonizing, painful learning experiences, say the word and I'll give you the 18 month run down on what is tentatively being called the Blue Turd(le).
    Last edited by 68scott385; July 26, 2013, 07:44 PM.

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  • SpiderGearsMan
    replied
    why olds ?

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  • Scott Liggett
    replied
    I'm thinking it near melted the exhaust valves on that side. Most of the cracks we saw without magging originated from the exhaust valve seat. Many went seat to seat. I'm pretty sure cylinder pressure was way up there too and contributed to warping on the other side. Bob got the setup without any of the other jet pills, so he just ran the engine with the 250 shot. It was stupid fun while it lasted.
    Last edited by Scott Liggett; July 26, 2013, 11:07 AM.

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  • Deaf Bob
    replied
    Originally posted by Scott Liggett View Post
    My main gearhead buddy in HS had a 75 Ford Elite that he built up a 302 to put in. But, it wouldn't beat my 71 Impala sedan with a mostly stock sbc 400. So, he borrowed a plate nitrous setup from someone. Obviously, he beat my car real good that night. Then we cruised the whole night and emptied the bottle twice.

    Next day, he was shooting antifreeze out of his tail pipes. One head was warped so bad you could stick a screwdriver between the block and head in three places. The other head was cracked in 42 places before we gave up counting. No, he didn't have a temp gauge.
    Was it hot...or pressure blown?

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  • Scott Liggett
    replied
    Originally posted by Deaf Bob View Post
    Dunno why most guys jump into the " cracked head" or headgasket band wagon..
    Yes it is possible the head cracks.. But in 25 years of getting motors so hot they don't run no more, I've seen one cracked head and am not sure it was cracked to begin with..
    99.9% it's head gasket or warped head
    A buddy had a leaky radiator in his 455 Olds powered FSjeep.. He claims he trained it to run without water...lol drove it several years like that..

    Edit: nice run stand!!
    My main gearhead buddy in HS had a 75 Ford Elite that he built up a 302 to put in. But, it wouldn't beat my 71 Impala sedan with a mostly stock sbc 400. So, he borrowed a plate nitrous setup from someone. Obviously, he beat my car real good that night. Then we cruised the whole night and emptied the bottle twice.

    Next day, he was shooting antifreeze out of his tail pipes. One head was warped so bad you could stick a screwdriver between the block and head in three places. The other head was cracked in 42 places before we gave up counting. No, he didn't have a temp gauge.

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  • Deaf Bob
    replied
    Originally posted by 68scott385 View Post
    The radiator is old and has a seeping hole at the bottom. I have a cooling system pressure tester but because of the seepage I haven't tried to pressurize the system.

    compression test
    1 -- 135
    2 -- 135
    3 -- 130
    4 -- 140
    5 -- 135
    6 -- 140
    7 -- 130
    8 -- 135


    I didn't annotate the vacuum reading but iirc it was in the 19-22 area and steady.

    And to clarify spewing, let's say that translates to what happens at the geyser park in Yellowstone. The coolant came out of the radiator and hit the garage wall, up high, and the only other time I have seen that action is when a head was cracked. In my experience a head gasket between cylinders would cause adjacent cylinders to be low or one would be lower than the rest if the gasket was leaking into the coolant passages or to the oil return/crankcase.
    Numbers don't look bad at all... Usually have water coming out the stacks (exhaust) if can't see it sprinkling out, if I wave my hand over the exhaust, will get a wet hand..
    As for spewing.. Never saw that, have seen the water in the radiator bubble..
    Every motor is different, even with same brands

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  • 68scott385
    replied
    Originally posted by anotheridiot View Post
    I can see you have mcgyver in you...
    Now you're going to cause my head to expand.

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  • 68scott385
    replied
    The radiator is old and has a seeping hole at the bottom. I have a cooling system pressure tester but because of the seepage I haven't tried to pressurize the system.

    compression test
    1 -- 135
    2 -- 135
    3 -- 130
    4 -- 140
    5 -- 135
    6 -- 140
    7 -- 130
    8 -- 135


    I didn't annotate the vacuum reading but iirc it was in the 19-22 area and steady.

    And to clarify spewing, let's say that translates to what happens at the geyser park in Yellowstone. The coolant came out of the radiator and hit the garage wall, up high, and the only other time I have seen that action is when a head was cracked. In my experience a head gasket between cylinders would cause adjacent cylinders to be low or one would be lower than the rest if the gasket was leaking into the coolant passages or to the oil return/crankcase.
    Last edited by 68scott385; July 23, 2013, 11:21 AM.

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  • anotheridiot
    replied
    The hand pump will take you a little higher than your radiator cap will blow to the overflow tank, so 15-20 pounds tops. You want to be able to regulate the pressure to see if it holds at 15 pounds because any leak, especially a cold block that has not expanded will start losing pressure right away. You need a gauge to see what air you are losing. so 15 psi thru a regulator, close the valve so you dont lose air thru the regulator and see if pressure drops.
    Last edited by anotheridiot; July 23, 2013, 10:56 AM.

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  • Russell
    replied
    so how much pressure would you say its safe to pump the coolent system up to? I would hate to blow out a good gasket!

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  • anotheridiot
    replied
    its just the good compression and good vacuum that questions the heads. those are the first signs, especially when its cold. you get that spitting from air pockets in the motor too, since the high point is the thermostat. These older engines also have trouble with the intake passages filling up with muck and carbon and not allowing good circulation of the coolant. best you can do is get a little pump for the cooling system. Slant makes them with a ton of other places for 60-80 bucks and you see if the system holds pressure or see where its leaking out of. dealing alot with GM 3.1 and 3.4 its a necessary tool for the intake gasket problems.

    I can see you have mcgyver in you, so an air fitting to a heater hose stub on the water pump would also pressurize your system enough to find the leak.
    If the compression is a little off you are dealing with the open cylinders while the engine sat needing to lap themselves back while the surface rust goes away, that should vary the compression a little, but cracked head or gasket should give you a pretty big variance in compression.

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  • 68scott385
    replied
    Thanks for the comments on the stand. I have progress pictures of that project if y'all are interested. I do not consider myself to be a fabricator or much of a welder but I try to do the best I can with what I have, and I'm a picky bastard.

    DB, I have seen cracked heads spray water out of the radiator just like this one did once the thermostat opened. I made a call based on my experience. From my experience it should be one or the other. In a month, because I have a hard time dealing with the heat & humidity anymore, I get back to work on that motor. I've had several setbacks with its new home. I've been fighting the next weakest link for a year or more. The only good thing I can say about that is that we're/it is running out of links to be weak.

    The cracked head in my scenario was a small Chevy head that for sure was not cracked or not demonstrating its will to evacuate coolant so violently for several months before it "overheated", words used to describe event to me, 3 times on the way home.

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  • Beagle
    replied
    Definitely a nice stand!

    You know how I know my truck is low on water? Heater doesn't work. I've never smelled or heard it get hot, gauge says it wasn't hot... some day I'll find out where the water is going.

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  • Deaf Bob
    replied
    Dunno why most guys jump into the " cracked head" or headgasket band wagon..
    Yes it is possible the head cracks.. But in 25 years of getting motors so hot they don't run no more, I've seen one cracked head and am not sure it was cracked to begin with..
    99.9% it's head gasket or warped head
    A buddy had a leaky radiator in his 455 Olds powered FSjeep.. He claims he trained it to run without water...lol drove it several years like that..

    Edit: nice run stand!!
    Last edited by Deaf Bob; July 23, 2013, 01:28 AM.

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  • 68scott385
    replied
    As a follow-up after a long for me fab project. The running engine I bought runs well, has great oil pressure, good vacuum, good compression test numbers, but has either a bad head gasket or cracked head. Other priorities, like its intended home, has kept me from working/diagnosing it. Here's a couple pics for those that enjoy that sort of thing.



    Attached Files
    Last edited by 68scott385; May 29, 2014, 09:50 PM.

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