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  • rebrush an alternator

    I thought I would share some rebuild photos. I found the new brushes applied to over 1000 vehicles. This is very uiniversal. GM has some extra tricks, the pin for holding brushes, separate rectifier, etc..but this is an idea for anyone.

    found new brushes, going ahead with an old one to refresh. this is actually not old at all. I may have found the remmanned error..its like they changed everything but old brushes. Very odd.



    the left one is just shy of half mark. New brush on the right. something tells me this “remmanned” was not what it was supposed to be, as if incomplete. the original lightweight springs leave these brushes at 100k miles or more. oh well. Can’t buy something right do it yourself even better.



    the metal with posts come through the back of alt. this is how I determine age. This one is young..maybe they did replace something important. bearing is like new as well. same for the front.



    sanded up slip rings..also young.





    cleaned up the leads awaiting new brushes. These were both bad enough where solder alone, with flux, could not self clean to a good connect. I stripped it down to nothing and used very find sand paper. Odd rebuild by whatever company did it. The brushes don’t match the time of other parts. Silliness.

    part two will be my masterful giant hand soldering job.
    Last edited by Barry Donovan; July 26, 2012, 09:39 AM.
    Previously boxer3main
    the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

  • #2
    alternator bearings



    A glimpse of the alt bearing, rear.. I thought “no. could not be.”

    yep. it is the same exact size as the pilot bearing for clutch. the silver new one is from a spec stage 1 set, that I never used. Given the alternator in photo is nearly brand new, it won’t get the bearings. The right bearing is simply from yet another, even younger alternator… will save for a special occasion. I also have another case half..has not even been used enough to gather a dusty mess.

    The alternator in the car may get the new bearings..there is a resonance occasionally on the way to warm. Still very nice however.
    Last edited by Barry Donovan; July 27, 2012, 11:13 AM.
    Previously boxer3main
    the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

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    • #3
      I just installed new brushes in a Dodge Nippondenso 120A alternator
      Turns out that there is an early and a late brusholder with either two or three pins
      Of course I did the wrong one first
      With out saying bearing quality is all over the place
      BVVC
      (some photos missing?)

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by wyrmrider View Post
        I just installed new brushes in a Dodge Nippondenso 120A alternator
        Turns out that there is an early and a late brusholder with either two or three pins
        Of course I did the wrong one first
        With out saying bearing quality is all over the place
        BVVC
        (some photos missing?)
        nippondenso..that seems to ring a bell. this is for a sube, and many others. They change numbers..but come rebuild, the brushes match more than 1000 vehicles.
        you can find it in the first of ecus and the 80s (60 amper- a fine power), many many freaking cars, not just asian. dodge, ford, the little ones..they can take it if the bracket fits. even a mazda rotary.
        Last edited by Barry Donovan; July 27, 2012, 06:55 PM.
        Previously boxer3main
        the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

        Comment


        • #5
          brush springs

          Being they did not replace brushes in 3 of the rebuilds..I was thinking the srpings must have 4 subarus and a millon miles each. I was thinking of a way to harden them, clean them..stretch a little bit. The new brushes for some reason do not have new springs.


          seeing the new brushes are only longer than the short used ones in my so called “remanned” alternator. It will increase pressure on the springs…but I was remembering a way to temper them into harder. I left on the burner for 20 minutes, dropped in cold glass of water. The goal is not to notice a thing.
          Last edited by Barry Donovan; July 30, 2012, 07:38 AM.
          Previously boxer3main
          the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

          Comment


          • #6
            "the alternator bearing is the same size as the throwout bearing" lol
            Last edited by SuperBuickGuy; July 30, 2012, 07:36 AM.
            Doing it all wrong since 1966

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            • #7
              Originally posted by SuperBuickGuy View Post
              "the alternator bearing is the same size as the throwout bearing" lol
              pilot bearing, sits in flywheel. throwout is very large..totally different thing. I bet a wheel bearing could make a thowout bearing.

              the front alternator bearing may be going in the power steering however..
              I'll have to check it.

              Previously boxer3main
              the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by boxer3main View Post
                pilot bearing, sits in flywheel. throwout is very large..totally different thing. I bet a wheel bearing could make a thowout bearing.

                the front alternator bearing may be going in the power steering however..
                I'll have to check it.

                those Japanese are sure clever about all the places they can use one part number
                Doing it all wrong since 1966

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by SuperBuickGuy View Post
                  those Japanese are sure clever about all the places they can use one part number
                  and then change the part number, call it something else..refuse to admit it fits a thousand other vehicles, and get away with a rpice range from 1 dollar to 50 for the same thing. yeah. thats clever. Military gets defensive for good reason.

                  anyhoo...more finds to fix on the kamikaze alternators:


                  another interesting find.. I could not figure out how these nubs hung out there uninsulated. The one aiming up had nothing. Some heatshrink operation and good to go, better than the oem one. Speaking of oem trickery.. the brushes I initially found were for 1000 vehicles. I thn found another set for the same car…but it lists for turbos and performance japanese..narrowed down to 360 vehicles. % more bucks, but with a brand name and seeming specific, will be getting those instead. If to tear into an alternator, do look close at these little things. “Remanned” seems to be a bad word sometimes.

                  I was glad to find the "other" brushes for the same alternator, even the leads are fatter. brushes longer, made by airtex. The new brushes, again, will need a careful partial heatshrink from the point of leaving brush holder to the connections in photo..else it will arc off the casing in certain thunderous weather..or maine just being maine 99% of the year.

                  I did not find this stuff until powerful ignition.

                  EDIT:
                  another quick repair to get it by. the current alternator is jumping gauge.
                  the alt above, all clean was awaiting brushes. I found two at 3/4 length (that is about 50k miles left) and soldered them in, insulated.
                  I took the alt going weird out of car and found I did not clean the slip rings. Not sure why I was in a hurry..anyway, that alt is going to get new brushes, after thorough cleaning. Even found goopy grease on the volt regulator connects underside..it still charged and worked. No doubt a reason they get away with alot, these things have a serious danger and need to be solid state foolproof.

                  So two good alts on the way.. the one I just rebrushed used was the remanned with offset brushes...strangely. Now goes like a rock, like it once did.

                  ****

                  an indicator for some errors on alternators...stator warm (outside middle of alternator- or is that rotor) either way, that is good. that means magnet is charged, alternator is seating itself. Does cooldown after install, some miles. if the whole alternator gets warm and no jumpiness on the gauge...the slip rings are dirty..but brushes connected. if jumpiness, the whole thing gets warm, and indicates a brush is not long enough or bad spring on the brush. Stuck to pegged on charge instantly blows a fuse if it is the car doing it, if not a bad volt regulator is not common, but could be culprit..clean all the connects at soldering points. No charge at all is simply broken. About the only time to turn one in for me..as the solders for volt regulator are very intesively tiny chores on this one.

                  rectifiers bad will leave no function at all.. as that is a danger when failed, they make it so no volts is allowed at all. That would be a/c volts flying high.
                  Last edited by Barry Donovan; July 30, 2012, 11:32 AM.
                  Previously boxer3main
                  the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    volt regulator



                    looking over the jumpy alternator..this one got hot all over, gauge climbed when volts were needed, but something too dyamical was happening. went up to near 18v, and back down to low charge light. I went to rockauto and found regulators from 4 bucks to 70. even an ac delco version to fit this. The solderings are not as intimidating as I allowed myself to believe. the alt checked out at the rectifier, as they are diodes..it is simply a matter of finding a pttern of direction with no return..or return reading negative versus positive.. rather than describe that, I can only say it is good.

                    An interesting thing was the epoxy stuff in regulator. this one had bubbles on its cover like something came through the regulator. The rubber stuff was brittle. 22 years old. Matching the miles of the engine it came with, puts it at 90k.

                    So, now I can build with parts of my choosing, less than ten bucks, ot take to near 100..up to me. AC delco regulator, airtex brushes is the near 100 rebuild. although the regulator is a bit steep, will hunt around for another ac delco seller…if not, generic exists. This is as new as they get.
                    there is combos, like ac deloc brushes and regulator, airtex also has their own version of both..pairing these together is probably something most would do as common sense. Me? who cares. I have had strands of speaker wire soldered into two different brushes to keep these going (I am in the woods it seems, before there was internet)

                    also, see the left bolt hanging down has a gadget on it..that is a mega resistor. Checking that is easy..I let it climb at its own pace to 1.1 mega ohm and called it good. it says 500M on it, 250v.




                    I opted to go for airtex..reg and brushes. 15 bucks total.
                    the photos at rockauto made up my mind. I am wondering if any regulator that has stamped writing or divets are the ones that go bad..as you can see, airtex gives a separate diagram, no labels on the reg cover. Solid cover.

                    the letter "E" also has extra spots on the alternator itself, labeled on the case, You can use your own wire. this is the -12v monster nobody has to pay attention to. Nearly impossible to mess up.. yet my car has. The subaru is flat engine, the battery ground goes way back to the starter, alternator is up front..what is inbetween? two spark plugs lit up like an accel can do them. For the alt to be reading the sensitve sensing for the sensor is not sensibly happening. I chose the old engine ground wire (now a spare, as I made my own engine to chassis wire bigger) with hookups in place to go to the "E" spot on alternator, and direct shot over to battery ground at the battery. . this will stop jumpiness. Can't get much closer to smooth out an unknown regulation problem.I chose the big wire to do this to match the battery positive feed to alternator. equal size for pos and neg. Not many cars contend with this.. I still think its the placement of spark plugs, and a boxer being linear lets nothing out the bottom like other engines to earth.

                    The alternator may as well be a thousand miles away from the battery ground, for an alternators purpose. I mention this, as this car and alternators is not exactly happy. the extra "E" wire direct shot fixes the only problem to treat it like any other car. Have not had this problem until recently..the last time was a 78 delta 88 in 1988.
                    Last edited by Barry Donovan; July 30, 2012, 06:09 PM.
                    Previously boxer3main
                    the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      tranny bearing

                      this was going to halt a rebuild, I decided I did not like old bearing...and had no means to take it off gently at first ...



                      Feeling brainy today..I realized the old bearing on the alternator to be rebuilt really ought to go. Here it is pictured with the bearing that came with my spec stage 1 clutch..The alternator bearing is the same as a pilot bearing. I only had one problem. the bearing was 22 years old.. pressed on. without the 3 dollar mini gear puller that I break even on japanese sized stuff…



                      I made this from the pile below to be a puller. Some ghetto suspension droppers, some threaded rod, etc. Sounded like a big gun going off when the stubborn old bearing finally let go.



                      The old bearing had plastic sides, as alternators do play with juice, I am sure the metal version installed won’t hurt anything. I put the new bearing on with some high temp wheel bearing grease..not only for another future rebuild, it is anti-magnetic.

                      front bearing is very easy, that comes next
                      Last edited by Barry Donovan; August 1, 2012, 03:03 PM.
                      Previously boxer3main
                      the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        comedy for this thread

                        how not to rebuild an alternator. the quote is my you tube comment for the video.



                        this vid is nuts. prying the bearing off of a sensitive stator.. a wrong sized socket smashing the plastic sides of new bearing cover. Does he realize on a normal engine those are designed to hit 15000 rpm? They make little gear pullers etc. the center punched holes on the stator shaft are for this. I have made my own heavy duty puller for very old stuck alternators..never EVER pry them.
                        where I said stator should be rotor..he beat the stator as well.

                        update on my own little rebuild. this engine is set to 8500, the alternator gets darn close to the 15000 rpm mentioned.

                        I verified bearing to rear cover by how snug it is to take back off, and without brushes in, the alt is a neutral spin. It goes on for more than a minute even by a hand spin. A hum climbed out before rebuild, a resonating noise. I knew then to get the back bearing to a new one.

                        As back bearing is smaller than the front by alot and the old was still good..this is another way of verifying front needs nothing. I may get it anyway, but I don't need to for this one.
                        Last edited by Barry Donovan; August 1, 2012, 06:28 PM.
                        Previously boxer3main
                        the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          front half

                          this was stubborn. the left grungy one was stuck on the browned shaft of the front of rotor. 8 inch gear puller to the rescue. Can't just smash these around. the nut is easy enough to get..but the rotor. its a goner once its gone.
                          lucky save..it did need a front half as much as the back.


                          I decided to just swap the whole front end. so this makes front and back half, both bearings, a volt regulator and brushes. the stator and rotor is the only original..lo and behold, those last forever. The old alternator was infected with something. I do not even trust the alloy. As if annealed squishy. Saved another one.

                          this is being done on my own as 3 remanned alternators had something seriously wrong. looking nice and clean..they were a monster. I found mismatched brushes, some longer than others, and old style regulators (heavy stampings - I guess this creates a problem). The one in car as of now, is perfected, as this rebuild will be as well.

                          the rebuild will be even better, as regulator will have no stamping on the cover at all..and brushes from the same company. the last little tidbit is a new nut for the pulley up front.
                          Last edited by Barry Donovan; August 2, 2012, 05:09 PM.
                          Previously boxer3main
                          the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            dry run casing

                            this turned out nice and quiet. pulley on tight..soldering is all that is left. This version of a rebuild, using the clean halves of a flunking remanned is a reward that goes beyond the lack of quality they gave me.


                            new front half (obvious reman remnant, simply clean by company who rebuilt it), new bacj half, two new bearings, aligned, no slop..pulley put back on in a way that should make next rebuilder angry at his pansy tools.

                            A trick I learned with the nut that holds pulley. hammer one edge to make it a lock nut. this takes a small amount of skill..just make it tough to put back on and not hurt threads. a squish.

                            next is soldering the brushes and the regulator, and that is on hold for now. A nice winter chore..unusual for me to be going at these extras this time of year.
                            Previously boxer3main
                            the death rate and fairy tales cannot kill the nature left behind.

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