Need help with MS2 install!!!!

[Caddyman]

Matt or 'Geek....
Bought a pre-assembled MS2 from DIY in June. I had it configured for hi-output coils, and am using a power relay board.

I'm trying to use the new TunerStudio for set-up/tuning.

When I (finally) figured out how to connect, I get a "normal" connection on Com 5, can read tps/coolant/map (rpm...I'll explain)...but to do it, I had to tell Tuner it was a Microsquirt V2.890? <this is from the controller...I thought it would be a version of MS2 while trying to connect...so........

I've yet to connect 02 (not finalized l.e.d/button mount, and haven't calibrated yet), so I don't know if the 02 is correct (reads 17.0 at rest, now).

I'm using an Summit/Mallory CD ignition box, and a VR output dist (locked advance), no hei module, reading VR directly.

When I cycle the key, I get fuel pump 2sec pulse, and (initially) had an rpm input (read about 130rpm-about right for a hi-torque starter) during crank.

Here's the deal.
I am somewhat confused (compared to the older MegaTune stuff on MS1) as to what to input in the base settings (other than * of ignition timing offset..that one was easy to find).

The old M/Tune had general engine constants that could be set (ie: CID, fuel injector sizing, highlighted "norms", ect).

On this version maybe because its a "MegaSquirt" not an "MS2"?, I'm not presented with my friendly "functionality" of the old stuff.

After attempting to use some info in the megamanual, downloading a few configurator files (as recommened in the manual), some Ini. stuff, and generally dicking around for 4hrs, I've somewhere screwed around with the settings enough that....tada...

No rpm input while cranking.

So, is this as simple as just "start new project" and making a few changes to base settings? or did I F-up?

I worked through the ignition settings, and (when it DID read rpm), left the coil disconnected (as instructed), so I can't confirm if it did/didn't have spark output on the CD box input (didn't make it very far, as the baseline I was used to wasn't there.......)


The MS1 seemed like cake compared to the new TunerStudio set-up.

I guess what I'm asking is.
What would be the "norms" in some of the new "non-generated" info sections.
And what do I need to check in terms of "re-baselining" the controller?


And no, I'm only novice computer literate...so no answers like.
"its as easy as dumping the ini. to the Run As in the configurator set-up screen marked msq.pos.ll-/.i-dont-know-shit-yeah. Imadumbass-<<beat-me-with-a-bat.file."

[dieselgeek]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

damn Will, I wish I could provide the help (that I know Matt can) but, my MS2 experience is limited *strictly* to a microsquirt running B&G code.

I will say this, lots of people are having real good luck with MS2-Extra...

Otherwise, I am not going to be very helpful. I know the MS1-Extra firmware almost as good as the coders, but that's about it...


hoping Matt chimes in here soon,
-scott

[Caddyman]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

Yeah, this complete deal has been a complete P-I-T-A-.

The MS1 took a week. In fact, it took longer to have a buddy do the upload with spark function, than to install it!.

This one has been in the shop a month!
And it still doesn't run.

[TheSilverBuick]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

I'm still a newb at this. I've been running strictly TunerStudioMS with my Skylark. I've checked a few settings on it against the MegaTune when I thought something wasn't right, but it's always matched up.

I'm running a MS2 with firmware version 2.89.

This might sounds stupid, but what Gauge Cluster set up are you using in TunerStudio? I have mine set to mimic MegaTune's layout and it is pretty much identical. I'm thinking it's not the TunerStudio that's confusing it, it's the change in options for the Firmware 2.89.

I read over DIYautotunes Nova install (http://diyautotune.com/tech_articles...part1-nova.htm) and watch the EFI configuration and first start up video one last time before I first started my car, and pretty much duplicated their steps and applied my specific application where necessary.

I did have to modify one .ini file to allow the maximum dwell to be set high enough for the MSD 6AL.

[Matt Cramer]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

The MS2 and Microsquirt have the same firmware, so our download package calls it "MS2-Microsquirt." It doesn't allow a slash. Sorry if that's caused any confusion. The most likely thing to cause a lack of RPM is if you've tried to set up a wheel decoder; set the Trigger Wheel Teeth to zero to turn off wheel decoding.

While the official setup and tuning guides for MS2 are written for MegaTune, TunerStudio is very similar. These should be helpful:

http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/configure.htm

http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/tune.htm

If you're having trouble, I'll be glad to have a look at the tune file and see if it's a settings issue.

[Caddyman]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

Well, after reflashing with 2.888, I now (at least), have an rpm indication again.

Its attempting to start, but its not quite there yet.
Its as though one side of the injector control isn't working. No flash, and the other "set" of injectors seems to be too much (fouling).

I'm checking the wiring now.

I'll let you know what I find.

Another problem I just noticed while cranking is a goofy rpm spike during crank. Its seems steady at around 140rpm, brings up a note of crank mode, fuel pump is working, and then..pop..3500rpm.

UPDATE, IT JUST BLEW OUT C16 ON THE BOARD WHILE THE KEY WAS OFF!!!!
Heard a pop, saw smoke from the general area, and looked around. Saw small pieces of yellow glass on the carpet....


I'm checking the case to make sure nothing else is burned or looks hot.


This is getting ridiculous.

[TheSilverBuick]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

C16 is a power supply circuit. You have the relay board and the relay board cable?

[Caddyman]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

I figured as much. I noticed left the batt charger on "start"..which in my case is a CONSTANT 40a/300a start.
SO, I figure the voltage shot to .....probably..... 18.5+V... trying to push 40a with no load?

The controller still works, reads, and gives spark...just a goofy rpm indication still.

I think I'm going to disconnect the VR input, go directly into the CD box, and re-install the centrifugal advance stuff in the dist, go to the MS with a tach output, and get it started....if it will

If not, I'll pull the MS1 off the other car, use it to make sure it runs, and then fix the MS2 when I get back from Charlotte in 2wks...

[Caddyman]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

Well, I figured out a couple things before I left last week.

1. Even though I set up the thermistor chart stuff, had valid matching coolant and iat sensor readings , somewhere in the mix (don't know what/where/why), the IAT ITSELF went OPEN. No backfire, no hits externally. I drilled and tapped a hole near the front of the intake (Edelbrock Pro-flo EFI...sorta like an LT-1 type), picking a spot that could receive no damage from the Tbody blades, tucked sorta at the 8 o'clock position so no linkage would hit anything, and nothing on the IAT cage looks like it was hit or concussioned....it just went open. Measured the sensor with a MM, and it has NO reading...not even on high scale!

2. Apparently, they CDI ignition I'm attemting to fire is causing the weird rpm problem. When I disconnect the battery input to the CD box, the spikes on the tach signal disappear.

The output VR wiring from the dist is in a shielded 2-wire conductor, the alum foil and 1 of the conductors is grounded at the MS unit. The CD box is on the opposite fenderwell from the relay center, the VR wires are seperated in a single loom, and never cross over/around/near anything from the CD box, except the last few inches near the relay center.
Even then, the only common wire going to the CD box from the relay center is a switched power supply from the Fuel pump feed circuit.
The CD box is fed batt directly from a junction box on the opposite fenderwell directly from the battery cable's normal "gen" 4-ga jump wire. The MS unit is fed batt power on a dedicated terminal on the battery itself (gold stereo stack terminal). The CD box has a dedicated ground all the way to the battery.
MS is grounded on a single, dedicated, non-shared ground all the way to the battery, in addition to having ground jumpers on the sensor return wires over to a through-bolted ground stud on the inner fenderwell.
I've done voltage drop tests on all the ground jumpers I made up for the other loads (batt to body, body to engine, engine to batt-to keep everything seperated all the way to the battery, when feasible)..and nothing.

I'm starting to think the cd box noise may be coming through something else. I won't have time to diagnose much in the next two days, as I'm heading to Daytona for the Turkey Rod run on Wed in the car (carbed....booo), and then Monday back to Charlotte for GM.....

So, I guess if anyone has any ideas?

Has anyone had any problems with an MS2- vs- a Summit/Mallory CD ignition box- causing THIS much noise. To the tune of 140rpm -4000+ rpm spikes.
And this isn't logged or scoped. Its visual on the tach readings in the T/studio screen.

The other car uses the same box with an MS1, and a goofy adapted hei module trigger (which is plain ugly), but WORKS!

[dieselgeek]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

Ground or power noise can come in on ANY line that sees power or grounds (can come backwards in through your points trigger wire to your CDI box)

If you are using the VR input for tachin, have you tried adjusting the zero crossing potentiometer to raise the threshold above or below your noise problem?

[Caddyman]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

No, I didn't mess with any trimming any pot...hehe...before semi-removing the ms2 unit.


I might try and use an old MSD 6AL I have sitting on the shelf and see if the same thing takes place once I get back.

I'll keep ya'll updated once I get back on it.

Thanks.

[dieselgeek]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

No, I didn't mess with any trimming any pot...hehe...before semi-removing the ms2 unit.


I might try and use an old MSD 6AL I have sitting on the shelf and see if the same thing takes place once I get back.

I'll keep ya'll updated once I get back on it.

Thanks.

you should definitely zero out the pots on the board either way. they don't always come from the factory in "zero" position. Give them a good 20 turns to the left. That's probably your whole tach spike problem.

[Matt Cramer]

Re: Need help with MS2 install!!!!

How is the CDI box wired up? There was a thread I just spotted on another forum where they were just talking about badly grounded CDI boxes causing a lot of trouble, oddly enough...

Also, how's the MS2 grounded?