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  • #76
    I honestly believe that with both projects - that my 'problem' will be to resist the urge not to turn it up to 11... that's when hyperuetetic pistons shatter, and glass bottom ends let the boost out.... so as long as I resist the urge, that last x% is safe.
    Doing it all wrong since 1966

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    • #77
      DG,

      Does the sequential injection allow skewing cylinder to cylinder via a percentage or does it apply individual maps per cylinder? Similar question with the timing.

      SBG,

      A BBB cam sensor is as easy as one off of the LC2 (that's Turbo6) with a gear swap just like puting a SBB HEI on a BBB. Though the DG method of converting a distributor is probably overall simpler.
      Central TEXAS Sleeper
      USAF Physicist

      ROA# 9790

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      • #78
        Originally posted by Bob Holmes View Post
        Do the math TC, do you really think that all the fuel can get in the chamber if you only spray while the valve is open? Look at OEM cam specs.

        And yes, fuel puddles on the valve. Has since the beginning of the ICE. Unless you are using direct injection, fuel will puddle on the valve.
        That is interesting, since what I read said they don't spray the fuel until the exhaust valve closes, so that you aren't spraying fuel that is going to go out the exhaust valve during the overlap period of the valve timing.........I believe it is done to cut down on hydrocarbons........ But then that's probably just something the OEM's do for emissions.........

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        • #79
          Math TC, give it a try. Its your friend.

          At some point you'll progress to reading articles with some critical thinking.
          Last edited by Bob Holmes; November 18, 2011, 12:13 AM.
          I'm still learning

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          • #80
            Originally posted by CTX-SLPR View Post
            DG,

            Does the sequential injection allow skewing cylinder to cylinder via a percentage or does it apply individual maps per cylinder? Similar question with the timing.
            On current release MS3x firmware, the injection timing is configured for all cylinders with a single table, the table allows varying injection event end time (or begin time, or midpoint of the injection cycle - your choice) based on RPM and Manifold Pressure (just like a fuel VE table only selecting times instead of fuel quantity). So as the engine speed or load changes, you can vary the injection phasing indefinitely. But it is for all 8 cylinders.

            Now, for individual fuel and timing - this can be done individually per cylinder. I set up the tabes as close as I could get manually, then turned on the self correction for all 8 channels (with 8 wideband O2 sensors). THis was the Secret Sauce in our engine masters challenge. Maybe TC the EFI guru can find another system out there that allows 8 channels of closed loop correction?
            www.realtuners.com - catch the RealTuners Radio Podcast on Youtube, Facebook, iTunes, and anywhere else podcasts are distributed!

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            • #81
              Originally posted by dieselgeek View Post
              On current release MS3x firmware, the injection timing is configured for all cylinders with a single table, the table allows varying injection event end time (or begin time, or midpoint of the injection cycle - your choice) based on RPM and Manifold Pressure (just like a fuel VE table only selecting times instead of fuel quantity). So as the engine speed or load changes, you can vary the injection phasing indefinitely. But it is for all 8 cylinders.

              Now, for individual fuel and timing - this can be done individually per cylinder. I set up the tabes as close as I could get manually, then turned on the self correction for all 8 channels (with 8 wideband O2 sensors). THis was the Secret Sauce in our engine masters challenge. Maybe TC the EFI guru can find another system out there that allows 8 channels of closed loop correction?
              If I'm reading this right, I could tune for air flow variations based off of manifold pressure and rpm to compensate for an uneven plenum distribution?
              Central TEXAS Sleeper
              USAF Physicist

              ROA# 9790

              Comment


              • #82
                Originally posted by CTX-SLPR View Post
                If I'm reading this right, I could tune for air flow variations based off of manifold pressure and rpm to compensate for an uneven plenum distribution?
                Yes.
                www.realtuners.com - catch the RealTuners Radio Podcast on Youtube, Facebook, iTunes, and anywhere else podcasts are distributed!

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                • #83
                  Now that right there makes me want an MS3x and GPIO! I promise I'll give the OBDII conversion a full shake first though if I can get the trans to stop leaking!
                  Central TEXAS Sleeper
                  USAF Physicist

                  ROA# 9790

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    That there is a major driving reason for me wanting to go Sequential injection on my L6. Just looking at the ports you know there are going to be air distribution problems, so hopefully I can balance it out and not just tune to the leanest cylinder.
                    Escaped on a technicality.

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                    • #85
                      why not 6 individual runners? That's completely solve the distribution problem (and look awesome)
                      Doing it all wrong since 1966

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by SuperBuickGuy View Post
                        why not 6 individual runners? That's completely solve the distribution problem (and look awesome)
                        Kinda hard to put a turbo on 6 individual runners, even if the blades are in each runner there has to still be a plenum. Besides the real point he's making is ports 1 and 6 aren't the same geometry as 2-5 so they will flow different by default regardless of what's attached to them for an intake.
                        Central TEXAS Sleeper
                        USAF Physicist

                        ROA# 9790

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          The port shapes are different in the head, so I figure there is going to be an air flow difference from just the head port designs, and giving the same amount of fuel will make the AFR's differ. Even if the intake manifold ports are the same.
                          Escaped on a technicality.

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                          • #88
                            with individual runners (an individual butterfly valves) you could balance across the 6 runners (it wouldn't matter whether or not the air is pressurized or not at the top of the runner) - we do it all the time in HVAC work. Of course, it does beg the question of "why?" It would be an interesting feat of engineering - would require either a Rube mechanical device (which opens each butterfly to a specific point depending on needed flow rate) or 6 individual electric butterfly valves and would require 6 2 bar MAF sensors and 6 O2 sensors.... but again, back to the question of why bother?

                            as I'm rereading this - I realize it could be even better. 6 vacuum gauges screwed into each tube, and 6 exhaust temp gauges screwed into the exhaust manifold.... and a video camera so you could watch it from inside.... hmmm, maybe I better get to work before I get any more good ideas
                            Last edited by SuperBuickGuy; November 20, 2011, 09:40 AM.
                            Doing it all wrong since 1966

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                            • #89
                              Originally posted by SuperBuickGuy View Post
                              with individual runners (an individual butterfly valves) you could balance across the 6 runners (it wouldn't matter whether or not the air is pressurized or not at the top of the runner) - we do it all the time in HVAC work. Of course, it does beg the question of "why?" It would be an interesting feat of engineering - would require either a Rube mechanical device (which opens each butterfly to a specific point depending on needed flow rate) or 6 individual electric butterfly valves and would require 6 2 bar MAF sensors and 6 O2 sensors.... but again, back to the question of why bother?

                              as I'm rereading this - I realize it could be even better. 6 vacuum gauges screwed into each tube, and 6 exhaust temp gauges screwed into the exhaust manifold.... and a video camera so you could watch it from inside.... hmmm, maybe I better get to work before I get any more good ideas
                              ehhh, that sounds a little un-doable to me. Better to spend the money on 6 or 8 O2 sensors and tune individual cylinders.

                              Although with forced induction, the transgressions of the port design disappear rapidly. Something about 20+psi of pressure helps that air charge find it's way to the cylinder in a hurry.
                              www.realtuners.com - catch the RealTuners Radio Podcast on Youtube, Facebook, iTunes, and anywhere else podcasts are distributed!

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                              • #90
                                I got some good info this week about grinding the end exhaust ports open quite a bit, or rather rounding them out.
                                Escaped on a technicality.

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