Wiring Ford Mod Motor coils into a MegaSquirt 2

[TheSilverBuick]

The follow up question to the Distributorless thread.

I have a 3.0 board running MegaSquirt 2/extra (latest version) and a DIYautotune.com external relay board. I run the IAC valve, second baro sensor and have it wired up for a knock sensor input, but wouldn't cry if that absolutely had to go away and I'm not using the Fidle output and the current ignition output goes to an MSD box.

I'm guessing they'll be wired in a wasted spark configuration and require four outputs.

I'm guessing the ford coils do not have a built in ignitor, so what does that mean to wiring them up on an 8 cylinder engine? What mod's do I have to make to the board to get the appropriate outputs? Do I need to purchase something to act as the ignitor? Like http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/q...ule-p-481.html ?

And lastly, if I do get a set of Ford Mod Motor ignition coils, are there guidline settings for configuring them?

[Matt Cramer]

Yep, you'd have to run them in wasted spark with MS2 as it has a maximum of 6 spark outputs. You could either use a pair of QuadSparks, or roll your own with some Bosch BIP373 transistors.

[TheSilverBuick]

So it actually requires a pair of the QuadSparks? An output won't run two coils then for wasted spark? How is that wired with four outputs from the MSII and then it would be 8 outputs from the two QuadSparks? Also does the Q16 BIP373 have to be pulled from the 3.0 board to run the QuadSpark?

What outputs would you recommend given the list of outputs I use? Reading the quadspark hookup directions, it looks like I can use the normal IGN output, then run from the SPR2,3,4 and essentially leave all my current outputs alone? These disable the LED's correct? I run the relay board and associated cable, so where do the SPR 2,3,4 output too on the DB37 connector? and how will this effect my relayboard wiring?


Follow up question. With the MS3 and a six cylinder, will I require an external ignitor running individual coils?

Thanks Matt for the help.

[CDMBill]

Randall, I'm using the EFI Source unit pictured below. Its been bullet proof for four years now.

[TheSilverBuick]

But don't you only run four coils? I'll only have four outputs for eight coils.

[CDMBill]

With this box you can configure it for four inputs and eight outputs. Your are right I have two four tower coils so I only use four outputs as the wasted spark pair is the one being fired and the one that is 360* away. BTW, They also have a six cylinder version. These are the guys that manufacture the EMS-Pro that I run.

[dieselgeek]

But don't you only run four coils? I'll only have four outputs for eight coils.

Realize that you'll be running those coils at double their intended duty cycle - they may get hot, and their life will be shortened. I know plenty of guys do the same thing and report that it works fine but... maybe you should look at the MS3x if you want to run coil pe plug? it's a simple upgrade from your MS2... ;-)

[TheSilverBuick]

Realize that you'll be running those coils at double their intended duty cycle - they may get hot, and their life will be shortened. I know plenty of guys do the same thing and report that it works fine but... maybe you should look at the MS3x if you want to run coil pe plug? it's a simple upgrade from your MS2... ;-)

The F'in guys on the V8Buick board about have me peer pressured into upgrading the Skylark to an MSIII The stuff is sitting in my Cart on the DIYautotune site (I really need to buy two, one for the Firebird and one for the Skylark) and I have a few emails from Matt on clarifying a few questions I had.

I like the looks of the LS coils, I just can't figure out how I'd mount them on the Buick's valve covers, and on the six I'm sure I can't make them look as cool as Gary did on his GMC because no side plate and the accessory drive is there, but I haven't given up on that one.

[dieselgeek]

The F'in guys on the V8Buick board about have me peer pressured into upgrading the Skylark to an MSIII

While I am a fan of the MS3 and you are technically capable of making it work - after signing up and doing some reading on the v8buick boards, there aren't many people on there who I would trust giving you advice on EFI...

[STINEY]

Can't they be remotely mounted on the firewall or similar? Or does that make the high side leads too long? Seems I've seen some remotely mounted somewhere before....

[dieselgeek]

Can't they be remotely mounted on the firewall or similar? Or does that make the high side leads too long? Seems I've seen some remotely mounted somewhere before....

Yep, they can. A long wire isn't a problem - eliminating the gap inside the distributor is a *huge* boost in spark energy available at the plug.

Although, if he does that, then he should consider running something like CDMBill, 4 2-tower coils which saves space over 8 individual packs, and he can still use his MS2 to drive them (only needs four spark outputs from the MS).

But the Ford coils will look pretty awesome if he can make them fit...

[CDMBill]

The two four-tower coil approach is pretty cost effective too and these Pantera EFI coils have plenty of output. The cost was part of my decision making as well as keeping all the stuff off the valve covers as I check lash fairly frequently. I was also able to reuse my existing plug wires at the time I made the conversion. A set of 8 IGN coils, same maker would be ideal but that is a $1,000.00 I can use for other stuff at the moment.

[dieselgeek]

The IGN1-A coils seem to have gone up in price a lot lately. I used to get them for $45 apiece!!! that's up to 19 amps available per coil, times eight, second only to an MSD Top Fuel magneto - for $400-500.

But ask Jeff, wiring them up is a HUGE pain in the ass. 3 grounds, a +12v, and a +5v trigger for each coil. That's 80 terminations, 80 places where a pin can get pushed out, wire breaks, etc.

[TheSilverBuick]

While I am a fan of the MS3 and you are technically capable of making it work - after signing up and doing some reading on the v8buick boards, there aren't many people on there who I would trust giving you advice on EFI...

There are only two guys on there I trust on the EFI. One is the pmueller guy, he's pretty sharp IMO, and another one is a guy that has been running EFI on his Buick for years, but he rarely ever posts about it and never talks techincal or theory, just his positive experience. As I said, it's practically a taboo subject there, but they have a BIG board on carb problems I like to cite when anyone really starts pouring on the hate of "the complications of EFI" because LOTS of people have issues with carbs too. Paul has me about talked into it based on light throttle cruising and injector timing. Plus I wouldn't mind using some of the MS3 inputs for that digital dash I made up in TunerStudio.


I could mount them on the firewall, but it defeats the purpose I'm going for (or even worse, make it look like it has a distributor in the back!). The HEI has been more than adequate for what I do so spark power isn't a big concern, I'm not running high boost or compression. I want to eliminate the wires going everywhere. If I use centralized coil packs I'm back to wires running across the engine from a centralized point. If I run individual coil on plug stuff I'll run small wires in a loom around from the back of the valve covers and across the top of the plug or if I can figure out a way to mount LS coils and still add oil to the engine I'd like that too.

[CDMBill]

Ok, so you mount the coils under the dash and run the plug wires under the exhaust manifold, hide the injector wires in a secondary rail ala Jack Chrisman and bury the other sensors. With work you hide move all the wires and pray nothing fails.