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How much tuning really?

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  • dieselgeek
    replied
    Better tell those NASCAR and Formula One guys they need to step up their game to Mass airflow sensors ROFL

    Leave a comment:


  • TC
    replied
    Originally posted by ImpalaSam View Post
    So in a nutshell the HPT trades some power and ultimate tunability for
    ease of installation? Fair statement?
    In your situation, I would say it trades nothing, using the stock ECM will be less time consuming to put together.... And as for tuning, they both allow changing of the same parameters to achieve the same results..... The idea that there is a "specific" set of values to get the engine to run it's best isn't exactly right, it's more like finding the "range" of values that it runs the best in..... So I would say either way you'll make the same power.......

    Also one added bonus of using the stock ECM is the use of a Mass Air Flow sensor as part of it's programming, which 99% of aftermarket ECM's don't use.... What these aftermarket ECM's use is what they call "Speed Density" programming, which is basically the same type of EFI programming that the OEM's used back in the 80's, so you might want to ask yourself why are your wanting to run your car on 30 year old technology that is really no better than a carb........

    I think the guys over at Mass-Flo say it the best...... They are the only aftermarket EFI company to offer their systems with MAF programming.....
    Don't settle for empty promises, GET REAL RESULTS! The other companies make it sound as if it's a benefit to have the ability to "tune" their systems. It's NOT a benefit... IT'S A HASSLE! The reality is, programmable speed density EFI systems are not much more efficient than a 4 bbl carburetor. You're punching keys on a computer, rather than turning screws and changing jets and springs in a carburetor. The end result is an expensive system, that cost almost as much money to get tuned properly as the initial cost of the system. And where is the advantage? They require constant laptop fiddling to keep running properly. You could have gotten that with a carburetor! They are a little more efficient than a carburetor, but not enough to justify the cost.
    You can read the rest of it here....

    http://www.massfloefi.com/why-our-system

    Leave a comment:


  • dieselgeek
    replied
    Originally posted by ImpalaSam View Post
    So in a nutshell the HPT trades some power and ultimate tunability for
    ease of installation? Fair statement?
    Fair statement. It gets you going faster if doing it yourself, although make sure you understand that some basic tech skills will be required... TC tried both MS and HPT and couldn't figure either one out, and if you ask him he's a badass expert hotrodder so.... maybe EFI is super duper hard. It depends on your ability to learn IMO.

    Leave a comment:


  • ImpalaSam
    replied
    I really enjoy reading the posts about the MS system and its abilities and I
    think it is something I would enjoy, but the reality is I think I would be in
    over my head. I don't have any immediate plans for an EFI swap but the
    idea of swapping in a 4.8/5.3 with a single turbo that makes more power
    and is more drivable than an old school sbc is very attractive.

    So in a nutshell the HPT trades some power and ultimate tunability for
    ease of installation? Fair statement?

    Leave a comment:


  • TC
    replied
    If you go with HPTuner's I suggest joining the Tuning School, their manuals give you step by step instruction on how to tune your car with HPT.... Also it supports up to 3 bar speed density or 1 bar MAF and you can add Real Time Tuning......

    http://www.thetuningschool.com/

    Leave a comment:


  • dieselgeek
    replied
    HPT makes the OEM computer a LOT more usable with turbocharging and high output combinations today than just a few years ago, thus it's popularity. GM spent millions developing the drivability tuning that's already in the computer, it's wise to take advantage of it.

    My opinion is there's more power to be had with a standalone like the MS or Holley HP / Dominator, but it take a little more work and is a little more "DIY" in nature than making adjustments to the OEM computer's calibration.

    With HPT, if your turbo plumbing isn't leaking and the mechanical bugs are worked out (not as easy as it sounds), one $200-500 trip to a chassis dyno might be all you need to have it tuned properly, - however learning HPT yourself isn't too bad IMO. The standalone will be a little more configuration and wiring work, and will definitely be more intimidating at first startup than the OEM computer re-tuned, but is better in some applications than the OEM computer.

    Leave a comment:


  • ImpalaSam
    started a topic How much tuning really?

    How much tuning really?

    I see a lot of articles/videos of LS swaps that involve turbos. Many of these
    use the HP tuners as the means of tuning the engine. Most of my EFI info
    I get from this site which usually leans more toward the stand alone ecm
    like the MS. That being said, how much "tuning" is really involved with the
    LS turbo swaps? Just curious. Some of these builds are almost to good to
    be true and would like to know just how much work is involved after the
    hard parts are put together.
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