Is :Larson's Truck Really the Quickest Street Car?

[dieselgeek]

To comment on the Reynolds family "following" Chad and Larry around i ask this. If your spouse or spawn were on the cusp of making history would you not want to be close and do your best to support in any way you could?

That's a great thought, but don't let yourself get sucked into the 38P spin storm. Not one single leg of the journey did Daphne's wagon (the one Daphne and Chad's Dad put together in a mad thrash before the event) follow or stay near Larson's truck. Not once. Larry's wife, and Chad's wife, rode in it and were WAY ahead of us. Usually traveling with faster cruisers. Be careful we don't play out on some hater's strawman stories that aren't true. Speedy knows he's in here telling bold lies just to get attention, that's how he works.

As for this comment:

"2. DG is so vain he thinks this thread is about him."

By the end of page four of this post I count 12 times that you bring up my name. DG thinks this thread is about him because a tiny little angry dude trying to seem important is making it about him.

"4. In Bangshift history, DG has been in a lot more flame wars than I have . . . which ought to indicate who is the one spoiling for a silly fight."

I get that you are personally upset with me for pointing out that most of your rant is founded on made up stories that you try to pass as fact. But I'd like to see more facts on this claim because I don't believe it. Maybe take a vote and see who backs you up on this.


"His unnecessarily rude incivility and constant agitation tends to push the boundaries of my Christian tolerance."

That's your opinion. Here's mine: you cause trouble because it's the only way you can get attention, and you are a TERRIBLE example of a Christian.


I'm going to exit this post. I'm sure there will be 20 more posts with more than 1000 words apiece from Captain Awesome. bottom line, I don't like him online or in person, he likes to make up hypothetical stories and run with them, and he's just trying to get attention by hammering on high profile targets. If the rest of the bangshifters got together and stood up to people like 38P, then you probably wouldn;t have lost so many good folks already that simply got tired of his same old crap, over and over.

Take care, and see you guys next year on DW! except for one of you. lol

[38P]

Not one single leg of the journey did Daphne's wagon (the one Daphne and Chad's Dad put together in a mad thrash before the event) follow or stay near Larson's truck. Not once. Larry's wife, and Chad's wife, rode in it and were WAY ahead of us. Usually traveling with faster cruisers.

Oh no, more off-topic rabbits to chase . . .

Okay, folks, let's hypothetically assume for the sake of discussion that the old man, 38P, who admittedly doesn't see so well, made a sincere mistake as to the vehicles I sincerely believe I saw numerous times parked with and otherwise around the Larson truck (there will likely be photographic evidence posted sometime during the next 365 days, BTW . . . I took a lot of photos and have had no time to go through them) . . . .

1. If one's DW plan involves carrying necessary "manpower" for routine tasks in other vehicles (routine tasks for the Larson crew including the labor-intensive changeover, virtually constant data-logging and tuning, passing out hero cards and fund-raising through t-shirt sales (those ordinary, average guy credit cards presumably do have to be repaid)), then one could say that the DW "support" plan has been crafted to skirt the letter and intent of the rules.

2. One doesn't evade the anti-mule rules by sending such vehicles on before or after the supported vehicle. There are no proximity provisions I can find in the HRM rules.

3. The plain intent of the competitors-helping-competitors rules is for extraordinary repairs, not entering 16-second slow-mobiles to provide extra seats for an entourage of essential personnel.

4. Larson plainly used the Reynolds vehicles to carry people who were involved with routine support tasks virtually every day, including apparently toting BSC around when it was necessary for other persons to "ride shotgun" in Larson's two-seat truck.

5. Hot Rod apparently made the business decision to ignore the letter and intent of its own rules on this point, so all of this is completely moot.

6. None of this would even have come up if DG had not taken such defensive umbrage at a mere passing comment about the obvious, unconcealed role of the Reynolds entries, nor had he needed to brag on himself about being such a Larson insider (i.e. using "we:" when discussing the routine daily set-up of the truck. ).

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Now, for what I believe I actually saw the day DG and Larson admittedly intentionally blasted past me while I was on the side of the road: (I merely recite this narrative in defense of my honor, because DG has now expressly called me a "liar.")

When I left Great Bend, I'm certain saw the Larson truck and the BSC Wagon stopped at a gasoline station in town. I am completely certain about this (I might have even snapped a photo if it . . . not sure). I was surprised that we were apparently so close together in travel time.

(I had stopped at the Great Bend McDonalds to blog some BS entries because they had free Wi Fi and my android telephone wasn't working with the BS site correctly . . . That put me a little behind on the drive)

I don't recall whether or not Walt's truck was present because frankly it's forgettable to me (sorry Mr. Reynolds).

Only a few minutes later (and not nearly enough time for the Wagon to allegedly get way far ahead) , I developed a problem with the U-Haul ( My fault, Squirrel . . . My fault) ,I pulled over and stopped with my flashers on. While stopped, I am completely and unshakably certain I saw what appeared to me to be the BSC wagon and the Larson truck speed by me. While It was mildly disappointing at the time, it didn't anger me nor really surprise me. I'm a slow field-filler and Larson is a star of the show.

It did cause me to rethink what I'd seen earlier that day, when Larson and BSC pitched in to help Cline make the hero pass that ended the day in Great Bend. I naively believed it was great sportsmanship . . . helping someone competing in the same class (which perhaps it could have been, but I now believe it was just anti-Lutz and Larson customer support)

I was eventually able to correct the problem and continue on, so there was no harm in their not stopping (and, in fact, I would have merely thanked them for the courtesy of stopping and sent them on had they stopped).

That's my testimony about the events of that day. I'll swear to it under penalty of perjury. I have no interest in whether or not anyone from Team Larson believes it. I was there and I know what happened.

NOTE: NONE OF THE FOREGOING HAS ANY RELEVANCE TO THE ORIGINAL QUESTIONS I POSED . . . QUESTIONS WHICH HAVE NOW BEEN ANSWERED.

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you are a TERRIBLE example of a Christian.

Yes. Sadly, I frequently fall short and I must rely on eternal forgiveness and Divine grace. My own efforts are as "filthy rags." As other followers of that faith know, the Way is a daily struggle . . . . (i'll stop here in deference to forum rules)

I don't like him online or in person,

Because we've never knowing met in person, I'm uncertain why you'd prejudge such a meeting.

I will say this, given my rather unpopular occupation, there are a fair number of people who "don't like" me (It's hard for me to grille someone for six hours under oath, pointing out their mendacity, inconsistency, mistakes and embellishments, and then have them develop warm and fuzzy affections for me . . . That's just human nature, I guess).

DG wouldn't even be on the first five pages of the list of "haters." I can live with that.

[RockJustRock]

O.K. we've had 3 or 4 "all I have to say about it is" posts here in the past few days. Everyone has then posted again. To say something about the last thing someone else has to say?

Speedy..... What in God's name is your goal in all of this? To have Larry Larson's EIGHTH place finish taken away for cheating? To have Andy Frost's car RE-CROWNED as quickest on the planet because it is more "street" than Larry's? To get an award from Hot Rod as the most concise and vocal commentator on their event to offset your consistently lackluster results as a participant? To get a bunch of BangShifters to say (as I assume you do) "Larry Larson is no big deal. He's stretched some rules beyond belief and outrightly broken others because he knew he could get away with it. If I had his money and his "pull" with the other participants and the officials I could go quicker...... in a Ford. I'm the nicest guy at Drag Week and if you doubt me I will argue the point with you endlessly in print until you submit?".

Larry Larson and Chad Reynolds are simply very capable guys and seem to me to be the type that would be fun to hang around. They have accomplished a lot and will continue to accomplish more. They work very hard at it yet still have fun. That guy Speedy from the BangShift Forums? Ehhhhh.... not so much.

[38P]

RJR, my "goal" was as initially stated . . . to see what BSers thought about whether or not Larson's truck changes too much in race trim to be considered "street." (Reread Post No. 1) That question offended some and has now been overwhelmingly been answered.

I doubt HRM even follows this kind of stuff so all the comments about supposed things I want HRM to do are completely misplaced. Hot Rod knows all about Larson's operation and sanctioned it (how many times do I have to say that . . . their rules . .. their enforcement . . . thus no issue) Moreover, did you miss where I complimented Larson on several points?

All the sidebar stuff about who did what at DW merely came up in the conversation. Beagle was right . . . this is not a thread about DW mules. But the topic did arise and I did post what I saw. Because HRM is okay with what Larson and BSC did, it's all moot. But it is insulting when someone starts throwing around charges of lying, vouching, and makes claims that are inconsistent with what I personally witnessed.

Note: if any of the stuff that some are getting hung up on was really important, don't you think I would have rushed to post it during the event . . . or perhaps even paid a $100 protest fee? (notwithstanding DF's admonishment at the driver's meeting to not be "that guy" . . . likely chilling such protests). But as I've repeatedly posted in this thread, Larson not stopping wasn't a "biggie" (there was no obligation under the rules to stop) and HRM knew about the Reynolds support vehicles. However, I simply will not be called out as a "liar" without telling what I thought I saw.

It's interesting that both Larson (if he's really a BS forum member) and BSC have both had the common sense to stay out of the fray (which I would advise any client, BTW), and that some alleged non-team member (with a reputation for on-line fighting) is the one repeatedly carrying the ball for Team Larson in this moot "tempest in a teapot." I would NEVER advise that! But I suspect the alleged non-team member needed the ego strokes from crowing about how he helped Larson and might have used the "we" term a bit freely to make his own contributions more important than they actually were (that's speculation, of course, insofar as I would not presume to know another man's thoughts).

Larry Larson is a huge, beloved star in the sport of street car racing. He's money in the bank for HRM and TEN. He one of the handful of guys that packed 'em in at all of the DW venues.

I am a "lackluster" performing nobody who never will be "somebody" (as DF likes to use the term "be somebody"). I doubt that I've got the know-how or skill to beat Larson in a Ford even if I had the huge quantities of money and time to attempt it, so any suggestion otherwise is ridiculous.

I do think that some rich guy could build a competitive Mopar or Ford and make the Unlimited chase more interesting. I'm still a bit bummed that Larson, given his association with the Aeromotive Mustang , didn't make his "statement" with a Ford. But his car is his choice. And he's obviously set a new benchmark for the sport last week

I do think the questions I raised in this thread were legitimate for discussion. . . and they won't go away as reactions to Larson's truck are developed by other rich racers seeking to be at the top of the street-car ziggurat. Nothing that's posted here changes any of that.

[RockJustRock]

Soooo.... your really butt hurt Larry didn't paste headlights, taillights and (of course) a trailer hitch on the Aeromotive Mustang. Actually that was my first thought when I heard he was saying "You wanna see Pro Mod?". A lot of reason why I think. The engine is a "Roush 500". My guess is it is built off the Boss 500 Ford tooled up for John Force. No water jacketing whatsoever. Plus registration as a handbuilt vehicle is a lot stickier than one with a cowl and VIN tag. Why the fascination with marque anyway? Larson COULD have just built a Camaro. Most Gens have been run in Pro Mod. In most eyes he did more than his part in keeping things interesting along with sacrificing a bit of aero and weight distribution.

As far as Larson's "beloved" status, HOW F**KIN' DARE YOU! In bold type no less. You REALLY want to say he didn't earn it? You want to use the fact he sat out one year to paint him as a dilletante and taint the triumph of his return? AS a freakin' LAWYER you want to blast the effects of "rich guys" stealing thunder from you with your pair of high ticket late model rides and your project you can't bring yourself to commit fully to? You didn't even notice the sarcasm from people here when you whined of a time crunch and carried parts that might have made your car a standout in your trailer when other guys rebuilt engines and yes, rear axles ON Drag Week.

But you do stimulate entertaining discussion. I like that. I guess I like you for whatever you really are.

[38P]

Soooo.... your really butt hurt Larry didn't paste headlights, taillights and (of course) a trailer hitch on the Aeromotive Mustang.

Not at all. I never expected the Aeromotive car to be at DW.

What I would have liked to have seen was someone at Ford Racing or somebody else with money in the Ford orbit sensing the opportunity here and writing the checks to Larson necessary to get him on the street with a potentially five-second Ford.

However, let's say Larson's truck was a Ranger with some sort of aftermarket mountain motor "Ford" mill . . . I'd still be asking the same questions about it because I think they're ones that will keep popping up as this chase for quickest street cars becomes ever more removed from what everyone else is driving.

As far as Larson's "beloved" status, HOW F**KIN' DARE YOU! In bold type no less. You REALLY want to say he didn't earn it?

Absolutely not! Larson's hard work and dedication to the sport are self-evident. His truck has run the number.

While I was rooting for Lutz this year (mainly out of familiarity, and the Oklahoma "Street Outlaws" connection, and respect ,and a sense that it was finally his time (remember he went along with the unprecedented "overtime" in TUL at DW '12 to his detriment)), I was NEVER against Larson. I wanted it decided on the track (one of the reasons I bought time for Cline at Great Bend)

Just like everyone else, I was blown away by "the pass" in TUL on Saturday. Larson earned it. All of the muleling business is moot because HRM doesn't care about it (and most likely other Unlimited competitors are equally as guilty of stretching the rules) It only became an issue because another person had to keep challenging my veracity and personal integrity.

You want to use the fact he sat out one year to paint him as a dilletante and taint the triumph of his return?

Absolutely not.

AS a freakin' LAWYER you want to blast the effects of "rich guys" stealing thunder from you with your pair of high ticket late model rides and your project you can't bring yourself to commit fully to?

That's ridiculous. I've never represented myself as anything other than a rather forgettable gentleman sportsman, with modest skills and a minimal budget. I don't expect to get any "thunder" from DW. My car isn't the kind of car they care about. My times aren't spectacular. I'm a field filler.

Unlimited is obviously a game for the rich. I am skeptical when BSC tried to weave a "little guy" myth about Larson and himself at the awards ceremony. But I don't "blast" the rich. They pay a lot salaries that keep this sport going .

you whined of a time crunch and carried parts that might have made your car a standout in your trailer when other guys rebuilt engines and yes, rear axles ON Drag Week.

I'd draw a distinction between "whining" and reporting. I admit that it was my fault and my lack of skill that were the proximate causes of not getting the 4.56 gears (no aftermarket axles, though) in my car by last Monday. I can put in axle shafts, bearings and seals, but I've never set up a gear before. (probably not something to experiment with before a 1,300 mile drive) Someone with the proper dial indicator, training and experience said they could help but then backed out on Saturday night. There was no "Plan B" for the gear swap. So it stayed in the trailer.

I've never overstated my own modest mechanical skills and freely admit there are plenty of better mechanics on DW (the Gebharts would be prime examples of this). But I try with what I have and for some reason keep getting back up when I get knocked down.

Sorry that you have so misunderstood what I'm trying to say. My fault for not being a better writer, I guess. How did this get so far afield from the OP?

[RockJustRock]

Communication..... I had to figure out how to post this. Doesn't the Camaro guy sound a bit, um, snotty? It's just the accent I'm sure. But if you want to find favoritism and rule bending watch for the Twin's appearance.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10152417326833063

But they didn't go to the rig or get extra hands on things, just this:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10152417379163063

Remember I think most of the special rules are cutesy tripe too, but for those who want to play the game.....

[nesabo]

Jeff told David directly that he called the track and asked if he could use the shop to change slicks. No different then going to a tire shop.

[38P]

The rules presume a racer can receive ad hoc "outside" assistance from local facilities . . . For example, Larson had a flat repair in Ennis in 2012, if memory serves. Larson also used the trackside garage that Bailey rented at Heartland Park this year.

What a competitor probably couldn't do is what commonly happens in off-road racing and WRC competition . . . setting up a huge parts dump and/or service pit near each track before the event so the competitor wouldn't have to carry anticipated parts, tools, supplies, and crew. But then HRM might say that's okay, too . . . their rules . . their interpretations.

[Orange65]

This made me think of this thread... I am sure I am chasing rabbits now...

[dieselgeek]

HRM knew about the Reynolds support vehicles. However, I simply will not be called out as a "liar" without telling what I thought I saw.

Tells lie, and complains about being called a liar in one sentence. This alone is reason enough to shut down the PC and get yourself to a doctor, stat.

(support vehicles are defined in the DW rules. might want to be able to prove they were carrying provisions for other racers BEFORE you wear out another keyboard).


And this is my first call for permanent banning of 38P. he serves no purpose, just here to troll and piss on other peoples' hard work. Anyone else with me?

[BlueCuda340]

WHile that may not be against the rules, it is for sure against the "Spirit of Dragweek" as watered down as that may be getting as the event grows.

[STINEY]

I've developed the theory that he is a mole placed here by HotRod to create drama - HotRods theory being that drama creates traffic, and trafffic sells ads.

(waiting to hear how HotRod is in no way affiliated with Bangshift in 3 - 2 - 1.....)

[squirrel]

I'm thinking Scott might be onto something there.

[dieselgeek]

The reason I'm even in here and angry at this d-bag is simply this: one of my friends thrashed her BUTT off, getting her car ready to be at Drag Week BECAUSE SHE LOVES DRAG WEEK and hanging out with friends she met there. Some absolute jerk on the internet is accusing her of being a "mule" even though she never once travelled with the Larson Professional Motorsports Conglomerate. She's reading this and asking WTF? Her car may not have made it, and may have, but if anyone "planned" being a mule then they would have probably not gone through the effort to shove a used engine into an old car, added air ride, put Holley EFI on it, gotten it running, figured out the "I can't align this" issues, then DRIVE it across the country to be with her friends, and husband who is copiloting another car. They would have driven a late model stocker. And at least one guy had to give up finishing HIS project hot rod to help HER out, and had to drive his own late model stocker.

If a car is being accused of being a "support vehicle" then the accuser needs to show immediate proof of what provisions were carried in that vehicle. Or shut the hell up. Or better yet, get banned forever from this forum.


Again, I say BAN. PERMANENTLY.