Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

[cjforumadmin]

http://www.bangshift.com/blog/Historic-Drag-Strip-Under-Fire-From-Neighbors-Scores-Minor-Victory.html

[milkovich]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

Gee... who could have seen that coming.

Why are airports (which are a lot noisier) allowed to get away with it?

Are there any "save the dragstrips" associations we can be joining? I mean, I like circle tracks too (and those euro-ladyboy road racers I guess) but dragstrips are dying WAY too fast in this country. We need a PAC to fight the yuppie menace.

[Falcon67]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

It's been quite a while since I was in Union Grove, and unless the town has grown a lot it ain't that big. Looked like an All American Small Town when I was there. Nice place. The strip is outside of town to the south, didn't used to be close to much of anything except cows.

Yep - 2000 census says 4300 people, not quite double what's in Merkel. I think there are more students at ACU than people in Union Grove. Why try to run off a long time local business - somebody need to take the econ notes to the meeting.

On the sat map, it's about 3/4 mile from the starting line to a close house and 1 1/4 or so to the edge of town. Of course, it's flat as a pancake up there too.

Edit - OK, so the yupps may have taken over: "REMINDER: From November 15 through March 15, overnight parking shall be permitted only on the even-numbered side of the street on the nights bearing an even calendar date during the hours of 2:00 a.m. to 6:00 a.m., and on the odd-numbered side of the street on those nights bearing an odd calendar date during the hours of 2:00 a.m. to 6:00 a.m. on any street in the village, except Main Street."

[SuperBuickGuy]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

perspective is a wonderful thing.....
An official is elected based upon the perception of the voting populace that he or she is responsive to problems within their jurisdiction. Simply because there's a meeting to discuss the complaints does not mean that they are shutting down the track. It means that an elected official wants to keep their job... and that, many times, means giving everyone a chance to air their grievance rather then immediately move to litigation.

If there was one bit of advice that I wish people would listen to more, it's this: drawing dividing lines and starting the name calling is the quickest way to litigation and you can bet that both sides are recording all of the inflammatory statements for later use - so why not try using the meeting as a chance for a town to come together through discussion, negotiation, and recognition that not everyone is the same in their sensitivities?

While being neighborly many times will end up biting you on the ass; it also is far better to be in a court hearing listening to all of the times and ways you attempted to prevent the fight rather then rehearing your bad/hateful statements restated by the opposing party.

[69satelite]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

do dome street racing in their town and they might think twice about closing the track they are morons that have now idea that the taxes will go up and people need places to race cars legally and by no means am condoning street racing.
Its like people moving in by farms that have been ther for 150 years ansd complaining about the smell :

[Ron Ward]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

perspective is a wonderful thing.....
An official is elected based upon the perception of the voting populace that he or she is responsive to problems within their jurisdiction. Simply because there's a meeting to discuss the complaints does not mean that they are shutting down the track. It means that an elected official wants to keep their job... and that, many times, means giving everyone a chance to air their grievance rather then immediately move to litigation.

If there was one bit of advice that I wish people would listen to more, it's this: drawing dividing lines and starting the name calling is the quickest way to litigation and you can bet that both sides are recording all of the inflammatory statements for later use - so why not try using the meeting as a chance for a town to come together through discussion, negotiation, and recognition that not everyone is the same in their sensitivities?

While being neighborly many times will end up biting you on the ass; it also is far better to be in a court hearing listening to all of the times and ways you attempted to prevent the fight rather then rehearing your bad/hateful statements restated by the opposing party.

Good advice. If the track had an "open house" and distributed fliers to the neighboring residents for free admission, hot dogs and soft drinks, it would go a long way towards smoothing over relations.


Ron

[38P]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

(A) city noise study determined that the strip was not that loud at all. Neighbors were subjected to 65dB of sound, about the same as a normal conversation. In a perfect world, city fathers would have gotten this news and dismissed the neighbors' complaints and moved on. Unfortunately, this is reality. There is a meeting set for January where the issues will be discussed again and it is expected that the leaders may implement some new noise and light bylaws for the town.

The hard-edged facts seldom seem to defuse either power-mad politicians or complaining special interests.

And once again, the aerial view shows the track isn't really that close to any residential uses: http://www.mapquest.com/maps?address...182&country=US

And the discussion about managing racetrack noise on the NH strip also applies here as well: http://www.bangshift.com/forum/index...8475#msg298475

We need a PAC to fight the yuppie menace.

2x! The only problem is organizing racers and racing stakeholders is probably harder than the proverbial "herding cats."

Folks like the NRA are successful because they've got some industry money, over 4 million active, dues-paying members, and 100+ year track record. Somehow I don't think SEMA-SAN is the entire answer because it hasn't thus far created enough grassroots interest and involvement. I can't see where the NHRA or other sanctioning bodies have been effective either at lobbying efforts or rallying the masses to fight back against track closures.

Part of the problem is the decentralization and disorganization inherent in American motorsports at the grassroots level.

[threedoor]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

How are airports 'getting away with it'? Getting away with freedom? Hundreds of small airports in our country have been shut down by the same kind of people, most on private land as well. At least the aviation interests have the AOPA. We have a crisis of private property rights going on and I'm afraid it is only going to get worse as time goes on.

[Mr4Speed]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

The smoking ban analogy is perfectly appropriate in this case, because the fundamental thinking at the root of it is the same. The noise is NOT the reason they are complaining, it's the excuse they're using. Same goes for property values-the track was there when they bought the property so it isn't bringing the values down. It may however be a ploy to bring the values up, in their minds anyway. This is Wisconsin we're talking about-not Manhattan island-living space is not that hard to come by. (If you don't like it then why did you move there?) We are becoming a nation of closet fascists that are in complete denial of it. They are trying to shut the track down because they aren't interested in it therefore no one else needs to do it. That's real reason regardless of what ever excuses they use to try and mask that fact. It's rigid intolerance of anyone that is different from them in any way-in interests, in values, or in thought. It's the 800lb gorilla in the room that no one wants to acknowledge out loud but it is exactly the issue that must be exposed and it must be fought on that issue. Trying to fight them on their claimed reasons will always fail-the only hope for victory is to expose them for who they really are because for that they have no defense. These situations are also often the product of simple elitism from the very same people that preach the loudest about the need for tolerance and acceptance. Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of happiness does not require you to get everyone's approval first. You can't do anything anymore without someone throwing a tantrum and screaming "I'm offended!!!" and this is exactly that. If we can't do anything without getting the approval of everyone first then we aren't free at all-that's lock-step conformity. We have a rather significant portion of our citizens that have volunteered to go halfway around the world to risk their lives in order to give others the freedom to pursue their own bliss. In a society where freedom is the highest value this should be shameful-not common.

[BluLightning]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

I was there this summer and I don't remember many houses being close. ???

[tcbnj]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

I was there this summer and I don't remember many houses being close. ???

Like BluLighting, I ran the 1320 there while passing through on the power tour last year. My recollection is a small, family run type strip in a nice rural part of the country.

While most points mentioned previously are valid, I agree that there is a creeping "we know what's best for the rest of you" fascism that seems to be creeping into our cultural fabric............a heaping bowl of not good for both carjunkies and society in general :'(

[oldrustycars]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

Ron Leek of Byron Dragway dealt with this a few years ago. He hired sound engineers who found the same thing, the track just wasn't that noisy. The nearest homes, of course built way after the track, only had under 70 decibels. And that was mostly from the PA system, which Ron had re-done to focus the system to the track. It helped the racers too. And a big shocker...the douchebag complaining the MOST, you couldn't hear the track from his house. Did I mention he is a lawyer? And that he bought land near the track for cheap, and hoped to make a big profit selling it when the track closed?
Besides that, Ron actually got his track annexed by the city of Byron. They loved him, where as the county did not. I hear they will allow lights to be installed and let him run all night if he chooses to. Take THAT, whiny neighbors.
I've heard that other track owners helped with money for this fight, so theres a precedent....build homes near something that makes noise and you have no recourse when you complain. Ron Leek is a truly decent person, in my minor dealings with him, and certainly is a friend to racers everywhere.

[38P]

Re: Historic Great Lakes Dragway Under Fire From Neighbors, Scores Minor Victory

The smoking ban analogy is perfectly appropriate in this case, because the fundamental thinking at the root of it is the same. The noise is NOT the reason they are complaining, it's the excuse they're using. Same goes for property values-the track was there when they bought the property so it isn't bringing the values down. It may however be a ploy to bring the values up, in their minds anyway. This is Wisconsin we're talking about-not Manhattan island-living space is not that hard to come by. (If you don't like it then why did you move there?) We are becoming a nation of closet fascists that are in complete denial of it. They are trying to shut the track down because they aren't interested in it therefore no one else needs to do it. That's real reason regardless of what ever excuses they use to try and mask that fact. It's rigid intolerance of anyone that is different from them in any way-in interests, in values, or in thought. It's the 800lb gorilla in the room that no one wants to acknowledge out loud but it is exactly the issue that must be exposed and it must be fought on that issue. Trying to fight them on their claimed reasons will always fail-the only hope for victory is to expose them for who they really are because for that they have no defense. These situations are also often the product of simple elitism from the very same people that preach the loudest about the need for tolerance and acceptance. Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of happiness does not require you to get everyone's approval first. You can't do anything anymore without someone throwing a tantrum and screaming "I'm offended!!!" and this is exactly that. If we can't do anything without getting the approval of everyone first then we aren't free at all-that's lock-step conformity. We have a rather significant portion of our citizens that have volunteered to go halfway around the world to risk their lives in order to give others the freedom to pursue their own bliss. In a society where freedom is the highest value this should be shameful-not common.

WELL SAID!

Although I have to say that when we're loaded up with the facts on their excuses, it makes exposing the freedom-grabbing elites for who they are that much easier.

Some of the real problems are that the elites often (a) control the media, (b) force the debate into "protest zones" (e.g. short, easily ignored public comment segments at city counsel meetings) and (c) hand off most of the real decision making to unelected, unaccountable committees (e.g. planning and zoning commissions).

We desparately need a national "rapid response team" of engineering experts, appraisers, lawyers, and public relations specialists that people fighting for racing venues can call upon to defend our "pursuit of happiness" via motorsports.