Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

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  • joe_rocket45
    Superhero BangShifter
    • Nov 2007
    • 1098

    #1

    Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

    My friend was working on a truck, 99 2500 hd 5.7 vortec. all that I know is that he couldn't fix it and brought it to me & another friend. He said before he got it another shop tried to fix it and couldn't....

    it runs somewhat rough and sluggish, sometimes bucks and hiccups coming on or off the throttle. I hooked the scanner up and it said the CMP (cam position) was -39, from what I understood it should have been 0* +/- 2.... and timing was steady at 13* advance. tried to advance the dizzy but lo and behold it had a v6 hold down on it (these do not allow the distributor to turn). I had a v8 hold down and put it on, set the timing by the scanner to -2* and the truck acted like the timing was REALLY far advanced. I did get it to start and it ran much better showing as much as 36* of timing on the scanner, but again with the CMP set on 0* like it calls for it will not start, drags the starter BAD.

    right now i have 2 thoughts.... it is a v6 dizzy (hence the v6 hold down) OR the cam timing has jumped. anybody dealt with this before? I think I can check the cam timing without pulling the cover by using a degree wheel and pulling a valve cover (looking for around a 40* ABDC IVC right?)... OR can a V6 dizzy do this do this? are they even different, suspect so? any other ideas here...
  • CTX-SLPR
    Legendary BangShifter
    • Jan 2008
    • 6011

    #2
    Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

    That's a crab cap distributor isn't it? Wouldn't a V6 distributor have only 6 plug terminals?
    Central TEXAS Sleeper
    USAF Physicist

    ROA# 9790

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    • jays67
      Superhero BangShifter
      • Jan 2008
      • 1882

      #3
      Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

      is the dizzy gear good ? they are know for eating the gear?

      Comment

      • joe_rocket45
        Superhero BangShifter
        • Nov 2007
        • 1098

        #4
        Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

        they look the same so I am maybe thinking somebody put a v6 one in and used the v8 cap maybe? or will a v8 cap not go on a v6 one? the v6 hold down is why I'm thinking that.

        and yes, the gear was ate up, I changed it yesterday, forgot to mention that.... trying to remember what all I checked, missfire data shows NO misfire, the crank/cam correlation code was being set obviously. the map sensor seemed to be reading backwards, 9in/hg at idle and 29 at WOT but I hooked it up to my buddies 98 and his did the same thing so I figured it was ok. it does run better with the map unplugged and showing 3" hg....
        mass air looks good, actually all the sensors look good. there is an o2 code being set but I cannot even fathom how a bad O2 could cause this.... will try and unplug it today..

        a/f shows steady 14.7 most of the time, sometimes dipping into the 12's for very short periods of time, but smooth, not abrupt spikes. I have not ran a compression check yet, probably do that today. i guess if the cam is retarded it's going to be closing late (40*?) should really show on the gauge but listening to it it doesn't sound like low compression during crank....

        still leaning to teh wrong distributor but hate to buy one on a whim....

        Comment

        • TheSilverBuick
          ALMOST Spidey !
          • Nov 2007
          • 22145

          #5
          Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

          Check the pick up coil in the distributor housing to see if it's the V6 one if you have your suspicions. I've heard of people doing this on Buick's with the V6 HEI's being more common than the V8's and the parts swapper not being to bright. Of course I think most those were likely odd-fire V6's, so in the Buick's case they would run, just no fire on two cylinders... Don't know how an even fire 6 distributor would do in a V8.
          Escaped on a technicality.

          Comment

          • SpiderGearsMan
            No Life Outside BangShift.com
            • Oct 2007
            • 22359

            #6
            Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

            probably two teeth out -cmp retard should be zero ..happens when intake is done , it runs but you always get trouble code -retime it , on tdc , just like any small block

            sorry , my cable modem fried

            Comment

            • joe_rocket45
              Superhero BangShifter
              • Nov 2007
              • 1098

              #7
              Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

              turns out it was a v6 dizzy.... they use a strange looking hall effect pickup, not 6 or 8 slots like one would think but one small window and one large window, they appear to be basically the same, just phased different...

              Comment

              • SpiderGearsMan
                No Life Outside BangShift.com
                • Oct 2007
                • 22359

                #8
                Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

                no , vortech motors use a crank sensor

                Comment

                • joe_rocket45
                  Superhero BangShifter
                  • Nov 2007
                  • 1098

                  #9
                  Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

                  right, they have the 4 sided plate behind the balancer and the dizzy just houses (what looks like) a hall effect sensor just to check cam phasing or something...?

                  Comment

                  • daved931
                    Superhero BangShifter
                    • Aug 2010
                    • 539

                    #10
                    Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

                    There is a hall effect sensor for the camshaft on a Vortec 350.

                    Comment

                    • BIGRAYJR
                      FNG
                      • Dec 2010
                      • 1

                      #11
                      Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

                      Originally posted by CTX-SLPR
                      That's a crab cap distributor isn't it? Wouldn't a V6 distributor have only 6 plug terminals?
                      CHECK THE BALANCER AND SEE IF IT HAS SPUN ON THE RUBBER RING.

                      Comment

                      • joe_rocket45
                        Superhero BangShifter
                        • Nov 2007
                        • 1098

                        #12
                        Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

                        read read read.. before you post!
                        somebody put a v6 distributor in a v8......

                        Comment

                        • SpiderGearsMan
                          No Life Outside BangShift.com
                          • Oct 2007
                          • 22359

                          #13
                          Re: Calling all technicians... (spidey, this one is for you! ;p )

                          when the balancer slips , it makes an awful noise
                          3800 buick and 6.5 diesel are well known for that

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