attacking a monojet

[Barry Donovan]

another diode (more igntion stuff)

thinking of what took msd CDI out here locally..it was always all of a sudden. Impressive when working. I remembered talks of a diode on the positive side of coil. New ones should not have this problem, I am thinking way back to the first attack of ricer cavaliers etc.

I added spare diode to the setup I have now, sure enough, a little more umph at the very slow cough speeds, exhaust note is different. It further verifes a weak volt to coil...not an error, it is built that way.

This assures me the CDI box is a good call, will be waiting for order.

I did find this much beefier diode and will add that before the MSD fires up, unless someone can tell me what MSD boxes are made of.. it really is not msd problem, it could be a signal thief in relation to the old subaru ignition. Enforcing allowance for transistor speed needs no kickbacks to function. A tight fit in the engine bay, the wires may be less than 6 inches for coil as well.

the car can't believe itself. strangest thing ever. Everything is "big" and perfect as it can go...ignition is the last thing. The hint of what diode did for slow rpms..look forward to a CDI box to own the big bad monojet..

believe it or not, the trigger (pun) for this pursuit was listening in close to the little n/a BRZ with equal pipes and giant intake. I am missing the tight firy bridge on immediate throttle. CDI is the only answer..the diode is just safety for equipment.

[Barry Donovan]

accel 300+ vs msd 5520

update on ignition hunting. The vid for non readers, is an exmple of what I am building..a 1979 subaru is similar to my 1987.

this does get precise in a place that has a very powerful unknown frequency stabbing everything I own. You should see how I built my home computer (proud at 45k hours).

I am going to go with accel 300+, not for a marketed sales pitch. I have a story to go with it. I walked into a parts store needed a coil. the original 22 year old was sparking out the bottom. Accel was right there on the shelf “super stock” and grabbed it 40 bucks.

Next was plug wires literally physically blowing out in more spots than a spark plug could not be reached. So..browsing the net I wanted the toughest low resistance wires I could remember. Accel again had some for older hot rods, points or not, the traditional copper wound had modern insulation. So I bought the classic hot rod wires. So now I have an accel super stock on accel super wires.

Adding a diode to the positive side of coil inadvertantly became a filter.

Rummaging eBay, I was even willing to go used CDI box, as this is not about hot rodding, it is a bout the last non-ecm carbed Subaru ever made being brought to life via American parts.

I was looking at the accel 300, found some badly written instructions at Jegs and began reading. The smaller package,(I need to bolt to a Subaru GL sized strut tower) risc controller, and epoxy coated circuit board has me sold.

Not getting much advice, and you tube videos that never have CDI in a search for examples to witness. I am going with this simply to match up all the parts.

c/n: the accel 300+ matches recommends on the accel instructions, and it puts out more than the 5520, hanging onto a timer for 18,000 rpms on built 4 cyls. This is about precision/correctness, not so much about racing.

the multi spark on a 2.65inch stroke has me cringing. the thump is a realistic 12 to 1 for americans to analyze, strangely called 9.5 to 1 by Subaru. they utitlize size of air fuel to come up with anumber. americans don't do that. A strange twist of runted air and static number being much larger allowed subaru to play with their japanese abacus. Anyway, with bigger air fuel, 92 octane is wonderful... the accel limits the multispark to 2500 rpm instead of msd at 3000. I want 87 octane to be the fuel. I want as rich as possible, as large as possible. Stoich down the middle as much as possible.

I have found parts with "racing" in the label is what this old sube needs to be normal, and sill not be a racer.

Never blame a carburetor.

[Barry Donovan]

engine bay harness


6 feet 6 inches. I won’t be using all the strands..needless to say this is a lucky find in my parts bin. Knowing Subaru injection won’t be used again, I rummaged through thinking of the permanent CDI box, and a way to unplug, and simply splice in another one..just from the box end, and not the whole damn thing, if anything should happen (and things always do). I also have a monster 1500w diode in the mail.. not sure if to get it to coil, or engine block ground. with all this distance, signals can stay calm..the only stab would be back through engine ground. I guess that is where I'll put it.

Digging at this cable found three spots of 5 ground wires sharing one wire..it’s a wonder I hated my Subaru injection. I am lucky in that all I have to use is the good stuff, this cable will be lightened up by several wires.

Some cool things in this cable. The magnetic pickup can now be on a shielded protected ground cable to preserve signal (old TPS signal wire), and the bigger volts of battery and block ground are also in yet another shielding. Switched lead and coil will simply be wrapped...or maybe give the coil the shielding. will figure out when time comes. Now the box can go on passenger side, as the congestion on driver side is already impossible for space.

looking forward to getting this done. When complete, simply unplug harness as one connector, and any box can be used, simply transfer over via diagrams by CDI box instructions.

With box on passenger side, it will look normal. Everything is fred flintsoned by factory on alot of cars for cheapskate reason. My own car has not a single item on passenger side.

my junk pile find of the day. I don't even want to know what a waterproof engine bay harness wth shieldings and protections cost.

I double posted this photo, asking a question to determine if I am protecting in the right direction. pretty sure I am.




I forget the net can gain even mor einfo, info I never would have thought to look up.
wikipedia on CDI

in the article, a CDI type igntion was needed for tiny stroke, high revvers. The slow induction, even on magnetic pickups is very very bad for a boxer whose only weight is its fire and inertia of 43 pounds (ea82-1781cc) of clutch and flywheel. Even mentions a rotary. A 3main boxer is in the realm of retards defining it, (it reveals that in oem runtime as most know)...a perfect candidate for 2.65 inch stroke, 3 main self balanced. Every fire is the thump to compress another one. I would love to dyno this...17% was gained in a ford falcon to big surprise way back when this was invented. I wonder why boxers highly dependent on this very subject aren't many places to be found.

[TheSilverBuick]

[Barry Donovan]

the more I go along, the more I am realizing there is a small powerful trillionares group who finds it inriguing in a bad way.

the more I dig, the more I learn. I am glad this place builds things. I am glad it breaks things.

I am glad there is ads pertaining to it.

[Barry Donovan]

more CDI stuff (before install)

learning computers in a tiny 8 foot wide steel mobile home from 1947..I could guess it wasn't even 30 feet long.

I plugged in the 350mhz compaq and slowly but surely invisible things came to light...that was 1998.
Obsessed with a correct path and dispersal of the clock generating frequency, it can even guide air without a fan blade..NO, that is not heat it is following.

anyway, oems always have a correct spot for ECM, usually under dash, the steering column, board upside down or close to it, the heater box is always nearby. I found this same car with an ECM had a strong heater. That physics path has never been explained in plain english, but I am glad to have learned it in a 60 year old steel hut and giant computer. I may as well have been a pc chip on the board inside the giant atx tower called a mobile home. Plug me in and watch me run.

found dimensions of the box, and mounting it where an ECM would normally go. Always easier said than done...
speaking of back aches. Even with the little sube jacked up to normal heights, it is still angles and twisting getting to the places.

Wanted to mention this, as CDI is not a success story, it is as troublesome as the original invention. Even porsche acknowledged the kickback from engine ground (plugs) kills it instantly. Same today.

so...

under dash a must do, A giant diode on the engine ground preventing kickback. Being accel went extra steps like a camera that could survive a plane crash..epoxy board etc. I will go some extra steps as well.

I snaked the harness through the same spot as other oem wires, there was an extra waterproof slot in the rubber they use to get outside, then I hid the wires within a channel at the strut tower. Sheathed protected end is outside of course.

I will have to point out the extras identifying "digital ignition"...it is that neatly placed.
I also snipped up some ends, got some connectors on in the engine bay side. A large one for engine ground, went ahead and grounded to engine, coil wires are thicker than subaru oem, protected in a grounded sheath, and got some good hefty connectors matching the coil screws.

Total time now just for harness is about an hour. Rather than cuss and curse when crawling around under the dash, I opted to do a little bit at a time. Mostly done already. I have it setup so the CDI has the short wire plug to simply unplug, take in the house or cool place to rewire another one much easier.

gutting the original computer from another subaru to act as the mount for the little CDI box. I simply gut it, use the base of the SECC case all ready to mount in the same spot, no modifying anything. As perfection in their attempt to stop interference, I have respected all of what they had done, and went further with very high grade sheathed cabling just for ECU signals.

should have this in by end of week.


UPDATE JUL 3
box on its way , in a hurry.. I also got the 1500w diode and remembered how good at filtering it was on the positive side of coil.. so...
positive side of switched lead is where its going. Filter the whole CDI before it goes to any coil.The way the metal solid core leads work, I'll find a switched lead on the backside of fuse box using the solid core as the plug to wedge.

The sounds this runtime makes with the density of chassis already, the well thought piping, the air fuel may be 100% bigger than origin. The only thing now is the fire..the carb is on its way to the superhero I knew a monojet could be.

with alot of little engines..that annoying wind up before actual work needs to take place...This one doesn't. It digs right in somewhere between a diesels realm, a touch of rotary whistle, and a v8 all at the same time.

[Barry Donovan]

transient filtering with zener unidirectional diode



One step at a time. I don’t like the thought of all at once wiring. Got the soldering gun out, braided the power lead to diode. This is the power lead for box under dash. Only a foot away from fuse box, maybe less.

With a 1500w diode setting a direction, acting as a filter, the solid core lead gets me to the fuse box, and can do whatever to crimp it into a switch 12v+…and be fused too. The arrow is the direction with no kickback allowed. they call that “transient filtering on a zener diode.” The bright red wire is the toughest machine wire I have ever got. I had mentioned the CDI is not exactly gathering lines at a parts store to purchase locally. These extra thoughts have to happen. Not all that many cars have dual positive battles at the ignition either..I can’t wait to not only set the pace..but kill off the long slow induction sounding like a mig welder on stainless headers, and keeping a timer into 130mph capable, after the cold start is lively enough to jump the unsuspecting.

In next planning, this wire loom should be all set. nothing more I can do. I went against soldering engine block ground into a diode..it may be using that as feedback like any ignition does. Not much else I can do for preventives..unless someone has some ideas. I did read about troubleshooting problems. The box needs to be hard mounted to be grounded or run a wire from box mount to ground. Glad I found that, I was going to give it a rubber sheet to stay cushioned with. The insructions changed my mind.

[Barry Donovan]

found error

still going at it before install.
To instill a bit of fear of powerful ignitions..if a ground decides to take a path following other statics, radio, wiper motor, heater..and the scariest of all: A fuel line (refer to bangshifts blog of the gtr that mysteriously caught on fire).
Asian vehicles are notorious for going in circles. Sexless babbling circles. Something can burn with no fuse interaction. The 85-93 subaru has burnt a bit of all of these in my time with them. Even the ECU versions (the craziest of all).

Today I found I can take the harness apart, each little plug, take extra wires out, and, this made me happy, wire the accel 300 straight to harness via the harnesse's own plugs. Solder, some crimps. Insulated sheathing, also to get a ground. Will look exactly like oem put it together...only stronger by adding soldering as well as crimping. Cleaning up the cable is much less intimidating to look at and decipher.

With this all done, the extra wire I used to heat the fuel line with resistor, and then ground to carb can come off. the monojet will be running like gm would have installed it.(very important after all)

Awaiting delivery anxiously, almost childish in anticipation. Not so much for a “hot rod gadget”, but to get a runtime that has never been normal in 25 years. The lightning strike a couple years ago while driving..I dreaded deciphering rocket science. CDI explanation and examples made this easy. upon checking for a “biggest fattest” switched ignition lead, one that does not momentarily pause when starter is engaged (that would be silly for ignition wouldn’t it); I found something peculiar while measuring. the shutdown on the main wire had a run on, the slow bleed to very low volts..then off. Found the error. the buggy is spinning in circles in the ignition. The first I ever saw of this was a 1981 dodge omni, then of course, many many cars right to the end of feedback carbs altogether. shamefully..as there is an einstein nothing will catch up to when it is correct.

so far, Adding up reasons in a summary for CDI is

• stop run on bleed (so the off is OFF)
• short stroke was too short for the fat slow elongated weak induction
• 3750 rpm in 5th gear is the cars limit…with no computer, this indicates ignition..plenty of power locked up on my build in the guts.
• 9000 rpm dead rev needs a limiter
• a chance for some diodes to really guide this around peacefully
• keep the stainless pipes from echoing sounds of a mig welder (again…ignition is too long on the dwell)
• avoid lightning (recorded a hit while driving)
• save the hood edge from disintegretaing the steel (lit)..along with all other panels replaced.

This could help battery and light bulbs..but the battery goes in 5 year cycles, never errored.



took all extra wires out after seeing I can take plugs out one at a time with a tiny pc screwdriver moving the latch holding each one. The plugs are ready for the accel wires, then place it back into harness via the map I drew out on paper first. Splicing wires is good only if the two wires connecting are the same in every way. The harness will alleviate that difference. Very important thing to do..This harness was for fuel injection, had a tps, maf, sensitive stuff. subaru did give that alot of attention. I will enjoy respecting it. I am even grounding the sheathing to take static away from powerful coil signals paired together in protection. Thicker gauge than the other wires of course...all wrapped safely.

the gold plated ones (male and female) are going to be used for the magnetic pickup signal.

So now when the box burns (I count on this, makes future easier), the wires into harness are exactly the same as accels box...splicing simply is welcome.

[Barry Donovan]

cdi installed

installed this neatly, made up the harness rechecked wiring 27 times...

does not work.

I am glad to set it up duel, I simply swapped two plugs in the engine bay and went back to oem. all fits under dash neatly.

Not sure what to do with this. I may try traditional magnetic pickup without the extra gadget that follows it (subaru madness) and see if accels reduced instruction set can understand..

A cool thing that happened was fuel pump primered right away when turning key on. Simply no spark. plenty of volts, grounded etc.
I did take battery down enough to smoke at the new fuse links. Calmed down after some time running. Something wants power..no sign of giving it.

do these work right away or do I let it sit there for now. No obvious errors and volts are in the correct places. I seem to remember this, yet another annoying trait of CDI in my location. Advice to let them sit mounted in the car and juiced. Something slow has to lay down a layer. This needs a duel ignition of course, to drive car around, let the CDI sit there.

I have 14 days to return it, will give it a few. the harness is no hack, simply unplug it by what came with it. I am glad all that extra came with it. My harness went to the harnes they gave it..and the box end gets left alone entirely. Easy for warranty stuff.

the normal checklist is all good, right down to wires and coil recommended.

first thing I really want to do is reverse what they called positive and negative on the coil..but am afraid to.

there is a sign power is demanded..but no outward direction at all .. not unusual for this tin can.

edit:
going as far as I did for the harness and dual setup.. it leaves confidence in debugging. sure enough the box does not pass accels own test in their troubleshooting pdf. The place i ordered from was ebay, the guy said he emptied a warehouse for auction and he has four of the boxes. he said if I mail it back in there will be a new box and an extra to cover shipping costs in return.

fair enough deal.

determining refurb was right away. this one is brand spanking new.
keeping this setup for the accel 300+, I sent in the warranty card.. I then go to accel directly after the ebay version of warranty is up.

[Barry Donovan]

mag pickup only

switching to new setup, starter gets very fast..fuel pump is doing what it is supposed to as far as I can tell. Just no fire.

I have not tried just the mag pickup in the disty..I have a means to set that up and will this evening to install tomorrow. One of the instruction setups is to remove modules that come after mag pickup before using the CDI..and recommended but not necessary on some others. Will give it a try.

it does not seem the accel unit is bad. the smart little gadget knows when to shut off volts. EXACTLY what I am looking for. Very rheostat..the risc processing is processing something after all.
So without proper signal, it sits there playing dead.

This has got to work. I am tired of the never ending mig welder shredder that does not even fire completely. Double butthole for ignition. this old sube had alot of double buttholes.

anyway..every time I swap back to the oem setup the fusible links are very warm. the accel is getting a signal from something and drawing power. Grounded to the engine must be the primitive feedback...like subarus, except subaru has that extra gadget in the disty. Cutting half the energy to get twice as much is a never ending dream apparently. git er done.

this photo shows the mag pickup on its own, taken away from module. HEI gm did this and some accel setups themselves did this to get the 300+ to work. No instructions for ricers that are bigger by nature..
Will give this a go. my spare pickup and module carefully taken aprt, luckily by screws. Under the gobs of tape is a lightly soldered connection given. this combo is 260 dollars at rock bottom auto..may as well stay thinking of the whole gadget heh? This, funny enough, resembles a 1979 subaru brat (identical pickup- they did not have module back then)...so. tomorrow is another day. if this don't work, I am literally going back to points ignition, also from an old subaru brat.

[Barry Donovan]

box is "caved in"

I can't seem to add anymore text to previous post. here is a new one.

box is indeed "caved in". Wondering how such a thing could happen..it is right in their ad. they use epoxy to cover the board. taking it apart is easy, got a look inside..the clear nail polish looking enamel is drooled onto the chips. must have had along time to dry.

The cpu functioning boards do funny things with cave ins. This accel like to thump like a heartbeat to the cars door dinger. Being a Sunday, I gave it a 9v power supply and let it sit inside a polished suby valve cover near a window. Shipping tomorrow. Reminds me of old graphics cards.

the mag pickup without the extra is only something else to allow it to work. This means no matter what I hook up, if it has got a normal signal, the box understands. this further verifies the caved in box.

So now I have 3 different ways, plus a SPFI distributor with a hidden sealed electronic magnetic wheel that I have yet to try. the accel box I bought does not have an advance curve, so I cannot use that. I could go beyond a grand u.s dollars in silly igntion stuff.

for now, back to slow poking lke a 250ci wtih a rochester onboard a 1781cc.
I will keep the little amplifier hooked up for when a proper box arrives. The ignition run is gentle wires, and about 12 feet round trip. A long way to calm a good signal.

[Barry Donovan]

perseverance (?)

I refused to give up..found some peculair errors. Box is in fact brand spanking new. No hack refurb etc. I checked diodes for unidirectional, etc. All good.



the diode was touching the accel case, and the clock was not held down far enough from the case to trust it. keeping it still by a drop of crazy glues holding it to chip cover below it..and back together.

the instructions leave a magnetic pickup dead on the car..so with another wire they called the tach, I got the spark this thing was supposed to create via a test. Strangely, I have tach wire feeding power to trigger, the neg mag pickup per instructions…and the tach? I’ll just have to find a signal some place.

for now, attmepting first start nearly killed the starter in strain. Forgot to retard timing. Charging battery which may be pulverized. Did not get a start yet..but wow. That is a very large ignition. I have not had an advance timing battle since a 301 pontiac. So, the box is good, after finding small errors that did not seem to matter. I only verified it is indeed a brand spanking new box.

I may rewire for something slightly different than mentioned, as I do not know if this will start..sure gave a strong sign of it. I need to power trigger, then feed it back to box somehow…and the coil, it may need to be backwards.

Tomorrow gets a ginat battery charger with boost mode if my under the sink emergency 1 amper does not charge this back up.

As it turns out, there is a combo of wires that I found on my own, but for a different car..so, I am not hacking after all. Just vague instructions for my setup.

should start...and it is a big freaking start (I can tell already.) if not. Worth trying.

edit:
scored a very large battery charger, getting tomorrow. Dad uses it for individual batteries on the rig. The car is freakishly welded it may take a day with key just left on to find the -12v tin can beelining lightning rider games the geeks built this with. Burning in something new is not easy apparently. Especially demanding a function to be large. I am confident the sheet steel and mig weld down low is plenty to pretend a 3k pound chassis for the big electrics. Do not try this with a USMB/Nasioc subaru... kids.

Every once and awhile, I look on the net for answers to basic questions on these carbed bnon ecm cars (how complicated could it be?) ...5 years later, it is my posts to find, with no real answers. the war goes on.
I am still jumped at some of the replies... to this day, if to meet in real life and get treated like that would be a wounded forum user by my "irish" fist..

anyway, glad to share the spirit of maximizing a machine here. This place has been great, even if you are not interested, the lack of hater is uplifiting. Loving rice is loving a shrinkers extinction.

some future engineering thoughts..I found an accel part number magnetic pickup, which seems trivial at this point. I have a gentle amplified version, and the regular standard version. something else in the mysterious realm is happening, and I am familiar with it. Especially after the 10thmig reel of weld onward. Even my fuel pump played dead for a fe wminutes one day..and of course decribing maine summers with chassis changes. wow. Nikola tesla would even be surprised. once it gets "it" ...count on another half a century to come.

[Barry Donovan]

plan 1

being slow voltaged to the brain, it is now 150 am..I smelled wax, remembered my car is still on a trickle charge.
everything that buggy does not only makes a beeline to my second story room window..it climbs right in my nose as if hunting me down to feed me more nightmares.

anyway..epiphany, being the non-instructioned electronic guru (self declared, this means mentally retarded of course)

the accel box passed the troubleshoot test. Very lively. Looking through diagrams, it seems I may have to rewire simply to utilize the white wire lke a points connection, and light up the mag pickup via an external 12v source. It resembles GM hookup with HEI mag pickup with module in, according to accels instructions.



another indicator this must be the plan.. the mag pickup wires by accel have no power on either wire. Not sure what self powered mag pickup those go to..but they do. The way it passed the test was incredible. This also told me the pickup needs a power source. thanks to the gm diagram, this has a chance in hell of functioning. I want module in for sure. A 12 foot run and small gauge wires...why use just a pickup with no helper?

If this does not work…back to the drawing board...of course.

Another thing I noticed is the clock (crystal oscillator/hertz generator...), I glued it down to stay still and away from the accel case. This did wonders for the multi spark speed. the clock must have been shaking on its own skinny stilts like strut hindered springs.

[Barry Donovan]

up and running

posted here at 150 am..was out the door at 5. The battery was dead, had a homemade charger trickling at it for four hours..I guess I could say overnight. Did not trust it. jumped up early. As it turned out, it was not the battery..the posts got so bunged it could do much of anything. garage next door let me use the portable booster, and away it went...

the ign 12v and white wire combo did the trick for the magnetic pickup. Very gentle runner, started right up lively yet gentle. no mig welding snapping noises in the exhaust. Alot more power right where I knew it needed it. it coughs at dead rev, really jumps in on adding a load..just drive. Errorless as soon as you go to drive. No cough. The spec clutch actually set the cough in motion..not carb related. I knew the ignition was going to have to be a brut for that part as well. Does awesome. For the fuel pump, it would not stay on after unhooking factory stuff and hooking up accels.

Followed fuel pump wire to A-pillar, form the back of car fortward..followed the color code of positive side of pump. Took tape apart that had been hand wound 25 years years ago by someone in japan. Found the wire, of course, right smack dab in the middle of a 25 pair bundle..but hey. I found it. I then gave it a snip and tuck, ran another wire with a snake to make it as safe and oem as possible with the clusterof other wires.…right into a ign 12v wire that feeds a flasher relay. why? with pump full on all the time, nothing changes its rpms. It comes on with key on, and keeps on keeping on. the flasher pulse sends a gentle thump of change whenever a blinker is used. Clever. it is not blinking like a blinker, I refer to the live wire that feeds relay. it draws a little to take away from pump sharing the same source of volts. No off and on..just a bleeder thump to change rpms a tiny bit. I then carefully wound the bundle back up tight..only a foot or so.

Still no hot rod…the monojet finally got an ignition it needed. Now onto the tach, another mystery.

Still setup for dual ignition..just swap coil wires, and the disty plug. I had a plug that matched the disty..just swap 'em.

more enthusing than the ignition that leaves no residual gas odors at anytime..is the fuel pump kicking on with the key. nice and cool pump now...and will be a better kick at 28 below. This will stay like that no matter the ignition mode.


ACCel 300+ fits under dash, wires nearly hidden in engine bay.. no one would know I was even there.

[Barry Donovan]

rev limit test

I'll give this its own post.
I set it for 8500...and it set it off.


its too bad fifth gear could not hang onto that. world record would be mine.


going for 130 with a roof rack on is not a dream anymore. I'd love to try loring this month..but its out of reach, even in my own state.