LS swap advice - 85 IROC

[MadmanMark]

I have a friend that has had his 85 IROC Camaro since new and has recently decided he wants to go LS. My brother will be attempting the wrenching. I'm trying to help figure out options and costs. Neither of us have experience with the LS (but we are free). Hoping to get some help here.

The E-rod kits look attractive. Something like the 430hp version seems like it would keep him happy for a long time, especially after living with 200hp for almost 30 years. I like the 480hp version, but it doesn't come in a kit. I have no idea how much the computer, sensors, wiring, and tuning would be if you started with just the engine.

I have concerns about the car's automatic trans and wimpy rear end. I'm wondering if both have to go or if maybe the trans can be built up. Would either of these live behind a stock LS1?

Any suggestions?

[anotheridiot]

What I have is a 36 Chevy coupe with the TPI out of an 85 IRoc, so its pretty straight forward to take the engine, harness and computer from the 85. I would think you would either check out a wrecked Vette to see if you can get the computer and harnesses for the LS engine first before going aftermarket, but if you are buying a crate engine I expect they have something for harnesses and control.

[SuperBuickGuy]

Do you have to smog check the car?

I'll presume you've looked up what, in general, it takes to put an LS in a Camaro.

On the automatic and rear.... the 85 305 700r4 is not a well-loved transmission, at least 87 up had the updates; but if it's been rebuilt, odds are even that it would have the upgrades needed... and probably would survive as long as you aren't doing hard launches (or WOT in overdrive).

Rear differential is the same story, not a loved rear differential, but as long as you're not launching with slicks and a stick, should survive the added hp.

I love spending other people's money - why not get the transmission with the crate motor? It's the same basic dimensions, probably has the same spline output, and you could (as needed) either swap the rear housing (for the torque arm), or get an adapter to install it on the 4L60E that comes with the e-rod motor? Then it's plug and play - and you get a transmission that's going to work with the 2 1/2 time more powerful motor. Of course, the transmission option would open up the doors to getting a manual transmission instead

Also, they do make kits to put that motor in the Camaro - I'd certainly at least look at what the kits include to help you plan your assault.

[Bamfster]

The 1st thing I always ask the "customer" ...... what is the end game?

DD? Street/strip? Is he set on a specific HP/ET or?

He could swap in a ZZ series sbc w/out a bunch of trouble and it would be a completely different animal. Trans and diff can be built to handle it too.

[MadmanMark]

End game is definitely a DD. The option of getting a new Camaro is attractive to him, but he is very attached to the 85. We have unsuccessfully tried to talk him into a gen 1 (which we have experience with and think would be way cheaper). I believe 25yrs or older is exempt from the smog check in IL.

I like spending other people's money too. There's a LS3/4L65E combo that looks like hitting the easy button (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/NAL-CPSLS34L65E/). It is a little over $11K and I'm pretty sure the rear end would need to get swapped. I also would need this - http://paceperformance.com/i-8185597...smissions.html. Looks like about $12K in parts. I'd like to go to the 480hp version and wonder if I could piece it together for not much more or keep a cam swap in mind for a future upgrade. Maybe that's the route we should recommend, but I wonder if there's a cheaper route.

[squirrel]

Figure out exactly what the smog laws say.

If he's going to put a lot of miles on it, a new engine is a good idea. If he won't, then a used one would probably last forever, and would cost a lot less.

I would include the cost of an aftermarket rearend in the estimate. That 7.5 rear isn't gonna last long.

[MadmanMark]

This is his only car, so it will get a lot of miles on it. I'll have to make sure what the deal is on the smog rules.

I was expecting to have to ditch the rear-end. For the rear, I was thinking a 12 bolt from Strange. Looks like they have something for his car at about $2,500 (less brakes).

[anotheridiot]

I told someone I was staying pre 68 because of the emissions laws in IL, but the guy with the 98 cobra told me they said pre 94 wont even be tested. Simple reason is the IL emissions plug in the OBD2 scanner and just check for engine codes on most tests, not even checking emissions, so if you have the OBD1 in the Camaro, I doubt you will be smogged. I know when I title the 36, if they feel you are redoing the entire engine to new crate motors, the emission standards for the current engine you put in the older vehicle is supposed to be what they test to, so along with the computer and factory harness they would expect you to put in the obd2.

[Mr4Speed]

Every question you could possibly ask about this swap has already been answered at thirdgen.org.

[MadmanMark]

Thanks for the thirdgen reference. I've found lots of threads and articles about LS swaps. What I think I've learned is that it can be easy for an LS newbie to get into an electronics mess with the junkyard setups., even though it does seem super complicatied. I was first looking at junkyard/piece-it-together vs full setup. Then I was trying to figure out which LS would be best. I think any of them would overpower his trans/axle, so I figured he could go LS3 and build it up later if necessary.

I tried to price out the parts and came up with a range of $8-15K. The low end is for junkyard swaps of the engine and back-end, and a rebuild of his trans. The high end is the GM LS3 engine/trans combo, a new 12 bolt rear, driveshaft, and misc. That $15K number seems steep to me, but I think it would be the easiest labor-wise.

Thanks for all the input.

[SuperBuickGuy]

at 15k, perhaps consider a body swap - buy a wrecked (totalled SS), the swap the early body onto the later running gear - from all I've read, it almost seems easier