Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

[BBR]

I have been looking at mig welders lately. Current pick is a Hobart 187 (220v) or a 140 (110v)

My question is, some of the lower priced (import) 220v units have an amperage rating of around 120 amps.

Some of the more expensive 110v units are rated 135-140 amps.

So are amps amps? Duty cycles are roughly the same.


Whay would you pick? Remember I am just a hobby welder rarely ever having to weld anything bigger than 3/16".

[SuperBuickGuy]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

Buy a Miller - Hobarts are made all over the place; including by their competitor Lincoln.

Duty cycle is the percent of one hour that a welder can weld at full power. Most home machines are 7-15% thus you can weld 7-15 minutes of an hour - the rest of the hour it has to cool down. (I use that as a convenient example - the percentage is based upon the amount of time you can weld over 10 minutes). Even that's slightly misleading because the welder will always start at full power, then as it heats up will lose power to the lead.

220v machines are almost always better unless you're weld sheet metal for the above reason - as you won't get the penetration as you get close to the duty cycle limit.

Never buy an import - they're all crap - including the italian ones. Also, people know that fact; so when you sell it to upgrade - you'll lose your shirt (presuming it still works). I sold my 110v miller when I upgraded to the 220v machine - I sold it for more then I paid for it because the price increases on new machines

As for welding, if you build a traile

[squirrel]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

If you have the wiring in place, or can put it in relatively easily, go for a 220v welder. If you think you might want to take your welder other places that only have 110v, then maybe a 110v would be better.

Amps are amps, at a certain voltage....it takes twice as many amps at 110v than 220v, to power a welder to the same output current.

Usually you pay for a bigger transformer, the bigger it is the more power you can run thru it before it overheats.

bottom line, buy the best one you can afford. Parts/service is important, and might be iffy on off-brands.

[BangShiftChad]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

Buy a Miller - Hobarts are made all over the place; including by their competitor Lincoln.

Duty cycle is the percent of one hour that a welder can weld at full power. Most home machines are 7-15% thus you can weld 7-15 minutes of an hour - the rest of the hour it has to cool down. (I use that as a convenient example - the percentage is based upon the amount of time you can weld over 10 minutes). Even that's slightly misleading because the welder will always start at full power, then as it heats up will lose power to the lead.

220v machines are almost always better unless you're weld sheet metal for the above reason - as you won't get the penetration as you get close to the duty cycle limit.

Never buy an import - they're all crap - including the italian ones. Also, people know that fact; so when you sell it to upgrade - you'll lose your shirt (presuming it still works). I sold my 110v miller when I upgraded to the 220v machine - I sold it for more then I paid for it because the price increases on new machines

As for welding, if you build a traile

When did this happen? Hobart used to be a part of Miller, and were built in the same plant I was told. I'm a BIG Miller fan, and have both a Millermatic 175 (220) and Syncrowave 180SD (220). I love them and have never had to do anything but regular cleaning and maintenance.

I would buy the best welder you can afford. They don't go bad, so you can keep it forever if it's a good quality piece. You will be able to weld sheet metal a bit easier with some 110 welders, but my 175 does a fine job. Plus, once you start welding, sheetmetal will not be your most common thing to weld. I've done floors, quarters, shaved handles, chassis, cages, suspension parts, and everything in between with my 175.

[jays67]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

also the electric bill i have both a 110 and a 220 both lincolns
if i weld with the 110 for say 2 hours the bill will be noticeably higher as to the 220 i very rarely use my 110 machine even for sheet metal i am so used to my 220 unit

[SuperBuickGuy]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

Buy a Miller - Hobarts are made all over the place; including by their competitor Lincoln.

Duty cycle is the percent of one hour that a welder can weld at full power. Most home machines are 7-15% thus you can weld 7-15 minutes of an hour - the rest of the hour it has to cool down. (I use that as a convenient example - the percentage is based upon the amount of time you can weld over 10 minutes). Even that's slightly misleading because the welder will always start at full power, then as it heats up will lose power to the lead.

220v machines are almost always better unless you're weld sheet metal for the above reason - as you won't get the penetration as you get close to the duty cycle limit.

Never buy an import - they're all crap - including the italian ones. Also, people know that fact; so when you sell it to upgrade - you'll lose your shirt (presuming it still works). I sold my 110v miller when I upgraded to the 220v machine - I sold it for more then I paid for it because the price increases on new machines

As for welding, if you build a traile

When did this happen? Hobart used to be a part of Miller, and were built in the same plant I was told. I'm a BIG Miller fan, and have both a Millermatic 175 (220) and Syncrowave 180SD (220). I love them and have never had to do anything but regular cleaning and maintenance.

I would buy the best welder you can afford. They don't go bad, so you can keep it forever if it's a good quality piece. You will be able to weld sheet metal a bit easier with some 110 welders, but my 175 does a fine job. Plus, once you start welding, sheetmetal will not be your most common thing to weld. I've done floors, quarters, shaved handles, chassis, cages, suspension parts, and everything in between with my 175.

ESAB either builds or owns Hobart (it's been a few years since this was the topic of the circles I ran in) but I know that ESAB and Lincoln build their welders.... ESAB is getting better, but their first machines were such crap that I'll never own another. Aerotherm (sp?) makes an okay machine. I've never liked Lincoln, the couple I've owned both spent as much time in the shop as on the jobsite.... but they were lighter then a miller so there was an advantage there when we were hauling them up onto a roof; of course, if they didn't work after being hauled onto the roof (happened a dozen times) bad words were said.

[KeithTurk]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

Don't cheap out on what you buy...who ever is going to sell you Gas is where you buy your junk... or at least give them a shot at selling you one...

NEVER buy one of those crappy Flux core POS's... they are JUNK...

I do have a 110v Mig that I love... and I've welded some REALLY heavy junk... for the rock business... Also have a Tig and gas...

All Lincoln and don't need a thing...

[Huskinhano]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

Theoretically it doesn't make a difference whether it's 120V or 240V, it's the watts that's important. As it' been stated running at 120V doubles the amps for the same amount of work. The down side is you must size the wire accordingly, that means bigger wire at a higher cost.

Determining the size of wire for a welder is based upon the size of the welder along with it's duty cycle, not the size of the branch circuit breaker. You'll end up with what seems like an over sized breaker in relationship to the wire. Having said that, friends of mine run this place at zip code 07645 http://www.car-o-liner.com/caroliner.../caroliner/en/ they sell welding equipment as well and do training. I installed over sized wires for their welder that they use for demo/draining because they were having trouble with poor quality welds. They instruct their customers to install over sized wire as well to assure peak performance.

Sorry for getting long winded but wanted to explain the need for a good quality, dedicated circuit whether you go 120V or 240V. I have this 120V welder http://www.htpweld.com/products/mig_...s/mig_140.html I run a 10 gauge wire on it. I would recommend running at least #10 wire for either a 120V or 240V as a minimum for a small welder. There are going to be those idiots who buy a 120V and try operating it on a 15 amp, 14 gauge circuit with high resistance and whine that the welder is a piece of junk. The cost is going to be almost exactly the same to install a dedicated circuit for the same size wire. cost is going to difference in whether you buy a single pole breaker at $5 or a double pole at $10. The wire is going to cost the same as is the receptacle.

I chose the 140 amp, 120 volt welder because anything beyond it's capacity is beyond mine as well. Plus I like the fact that it's portable as long as I find a good 20 amp circuit if I do a light duty job, such a sheet metal that I couldn't do with a 240V. I also settled on the HTP because it had a much better quality transformer then the other welders I looked at. Much of it's 135 pounds is transformer with copper windings, not aluminum. BTW, I've had my HTP welder for 17 years and it's been flawless!

[Weldangrind]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

When did this happen? Hobart used to be a part of Miller, and were built in the same plant I was told. I'm a BIG Miller fan, and have both a Millermatic 175 (220) and Syncrowave 180SD (220). I love them and have never had to do anything but regular cleaning and maintenance.

I would have had the same opinion as Chad before hearing your comment, Buickguy. The Millermatic 180 and the Hobart Handler 180 are virtually identical under the hood; the only real difference I could find (along with the welding specialist at the store) was the adjustment mechanism for wire tension. The Miller was all metal, while the Hobart had plastic parts. The only external difference was the voltage setting. The Hobart gives you six voltage settings where the Miller uses a rheostat-type control that is infinite between 1 and 10. I spend more time between 2 and 3 or between 3 and 4 than on a specific number. The Millermatic control is excellent, and I've been happy with the extra power that the 220vac provides.

Like Chad said, I love my 175 and have never had to repair it.

[oldsman496]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

I have a little Lincoln 110v unit. Bought it brand new from Wieler Welding along with the tank lease. I will almost always cheap out on stuff except for big dollar tools. (and drivetrain parts ) I couldn't be happier. It could be a bigger unit, sure, but It has been very reliable this last 14 yrs.....

[milner351]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

I bought a very very used Lincoln Sp200 - it's a freaking tank, I paid $400 for it, and I see them now on ebay for around twice that.

I have welded everything from exhaust tubing to 3/8" plate with .035 or .030 wire (I would swap to thinner before doing body work)
as stated above - the well built machines don't really wear out - trust me if they did - mine would be and it's not.
(this I guess is like a chevy/ford thing - lincoln/miller - I'd be happy either way)

I would love to get a miller ac/dc tig machine at some point in the future - but it aint in the budget now.

If you will do most of your welding at home - get a 220 for sure, even if you have to run the circuit - it's worth it to have the power and the lower utility bill.

I picked up a used 110v flux core mig at a swap meet for $50 - and it pulls low enough amps to run off a portable generator - which comes in very handy at times. For odd jobs or outdoor jobs - flux core 110 portable is hard to beat.

I think this is one of those things that "one size fits all" does NOT apply.

[outlaw57]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

go big, go miller, I have amillermatic 251 and love it, with a alum spoolgun also.

Go to your welding supplier, ask for the service guy....he will usally have some used machines that the owners gave him not wanting to fix, and he fixed on the side, cheaper and usally great!

[DanStokes]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

I have a Lincoln 120V unit that's at least 15 years old (I bought it used from a friend who bought it new) and it has never taken a false step. The worst that's happened is that the wire will stop feeding and I'll have to clean the inner tip. I've been thinking about a bigger machine for roll cages, etc. but Keith inspected the cage in the Camaro and he says the penetration looks OK - the cage isn't painted yet so you can see the discoloration. Anyhow, it's a great little machine and I can recommend it. At work we had a series of Millers and they were good, too.

Dan

[Falcon67]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

I have a Hobart 140 - new - and it works very well. Got it for a good price too. If I had one "shoulda", I shoulda got the 187. The 140 will tack real .125 CRS (think roll bar), but it really doesn't have the oomph to weld it with good penetration. Everything else it does excellent. IMHO.

[CTX-SLPR]

Re: Welders 220v low amp vs. 110v high amp

I have a little Lincoln 110v unit. Bought it brand new from Wieler Welding along with the tank lease. I will almost always cheap out on stuff except for big dollar tools. (and drivetrain parts ) I couldn't be happier. It could be a bigger unit, sure, but It has been very reliable this last 14 yrs.....

I have the exact same setup (including who my tank is from) and its been great except for I did need to borrow a 220V welder to weld the heavier plate for my motor mounts. Next welder I get is going to be a Miller Sychrowave 220V TIG setup but thats a few years down the road.