The "Whatever" Project

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

Got back to the seat mount today. Used the tube bender on its new stand. Nothing in the way, rolled it into the light. And bend some tubing!
It matches the layout! No twist end to end. I amazed myself! Granted that's not difficult, but just the same...

So then cut 2 intermediate brace tubes for the inner sides of the seats to rest on, the take an hour going to the hardware store for a new 1 inch hole saw, and finally tack welded it together.
Here's the assembly holding up the seats. Notice the space between them!? I think 2 people might actually be able to ride in it together with room to spare, sort of! Took a picture from underneath. Have to make a couple of supports from the frame to the bottom of the seat mount tomorrow and maybe then I can get to the steering column...
Never throw out scraps of wood. Never know when you are going to need a spacer or 2. Plenty of room under here. I suppose sooner or later I'll have to cut the body above the qc a little bit. I'm contemplating an 1/8 inch steel tunnel for the driveshaft supported by a crossmember at each end to perform a couple of functions: safety and part of the floor.

Having those 3 tools on wheeled carts is very handy. It made using them a breeze. Didn't have to move anything each time I used one. Now I'm contemplating if the fancy tube notcher I have should be a stand alone, or just keep using the vise when I need it.

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

Woo hoo! Seat mount! Ta done!
And when I sit in the Whatever my left arm assumes that perfect cruising position over the side!

Now that's a win. Looking at the 2nd picture you can see that the seat is supported on the flat portion of the seat bottom. 4 button head bolts thru the bottom and when I finish the roll bar support hoop, there's going to be a seat back brace for both seats. Don't know what it'll look exactly like but I have an idea for it.

Tomorrow (maybe?) it's on to the steering column support. Maybe, hopefully, I can dream anyway!

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

Finally, got the steering column support made and attached to the Whatever today. Got the body off, and the support structures back in place for some serious time in the next couple of days with a welder. So finally a few pictures and oriented properly.
From the back, still need to make the seat back plates.
Looking at left seat upright.
Steering column support bracketry and cowl support hoop. I might shorten the column support bracketry about an inch. It's a touch close to the family jewels...
Thinking about the engine mount system, an engine plate might be a solution to stiffening the cowl support hoop. It could bolt to the back of the block and to the hoop, tieing them together. It would replace those 21/4 inch steel plate engine mounts currently holding up the back of the engine.
Just a view showing how the seats fit. That hoop behind them fits just under the rear of the tub.
More of the seats.
Yeah getting bored!
And this gives an idea of the seating position.

So some welding on the stuff in the pictures, and then onto the engine mounts. It's like Sheldon's 3D chess game crossed with 3D Tetris. Keeping all of the next ??? amount of moves.

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

WOW! This is post 544! See what you created Dan? It's all your fault! But seriously, man, can I run on or what?

Got some pictures to share, and lots of words. Lots of words...

Notice anything in the first 2 pictures? I'm going with the T10 instead of the T5. Got parts on the way to turn it back into a complete working transmission. It saves quite a bit of room down where my feet need to be. I was going to use the empty case for now, but the front bearing retainer/throwout bearing collar on the shorty is bigger than the one for the empty case. That is the bolt pattern is different and it appears that the front bearing would also be larger. The tailhousing appears to be the same, so I swapped it out fro the shortened one's much modified part.

Now using Dan's CAD method, I started fitting an engine plate that will be the rear engine mount, a part of the firewall, and a stiffening member for the cowl support hoop.
I cut the cardboard to match dimensions of the aluminum plate that I have for the engine plate and cut it to fit around the bellhousing. The bellhousing is completely round and 14 inches in diameter, just like an abrasive cutoff saw disc. Made a great template layout tool. You can see that the template is above the top of the cowl support hoop.

It's hard to see here, the engine's oil pan lowest point is about 1.5 inches above the bottom of the lower frame tubes. I'm going to lower the engine around an inch and set it so that the engine plate is perpendicular to the frame rails and will be bolted to the cowl support hoop and frame rails once I make some flanges for the motor plate to bolt on to. I'm going to make spacers the thickness of the body'sfirewall and will sandwich the fiberglass firewall between the engine plate and the cowl support hoop.

I cut the firewall to clear the engine, and fortunately I kept the cutout. Once I get the engine plate and cowl support hoop mated, I'll determine where the body needs to be drilled to fit around the spacers mentioned earlier, and then fit the firewall cutout part to fit around the bellhousing. And I guess that it'll be time to learn how to do fiberglassing.

This is how it looks now. Once that is done, I'll be making an outer firewall skin from aluminum sheet that will make it sealed up. There will be a couple of angles bolted to the engine plate at the level of the floor to support the front of the floor at the firewall. I'm going to make a bellhousing/transmission/driveshaft tunnel with driveshaft retaining straps to seal up the inside of the car from the road.

So some progress this weekend but I'm still a long way off from shakedown. This project is going to have me talking to myself before it's done, and probably answering back!

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

While watching F1 followed by NASCRAP, I was looking to see if there's a shifter setup that puts the shifter arms down, instead of up, per normal. I found a Saginaw shifter, but it would take too much work to hook it to the transmission, as it was designed to bolt to the floor.

So what to do? Given so cogitation and rumination, I think that I have a plan. I'd also like to move the shifter closer to the front at the same time. I'm thinking that I can make a mounting plate to bolt a Hurst shifter to, create some bell crank widgets that will pivot near the tail of the tailhousing near the output shaft. And then run shift rods back to them and then forward to upside down shift arms on the transmission. I can probably also change the ratios a bit to make it shift shorter.

Anybody ever do this? Post pictures if you have. I don't mind plaigerizing a good idea...

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

Today was the engine plate. 6061-T6 cut out to match the diameter of the bellhousing. It will clear a 153 tooth flywheel, same as the bellhousing.
Cut out and just set over the outside of the bellhousing. Marked the plate for the radius yesterday, cut it today. Saber saw with a coarse blade, rubbed with paraffin, same as your mother would use for canning jars of jam. Cut thru about 1/4 at a time, recoating before the next segment. Once cut, I used a 4-1/2 inch angle grinder with a flap disc to grind to the scribe line.

A couple years ago when Eastwood first introduced their surface conditioning grinder, I bough one at the introductory price, which was a really good price. But I haven't used it much. The neighbor's son used it to clean rust, grunge and paint off of the trailer he has so we could fix the tongue. As Dan always said, "A job worth doing, is worth overdoing!", and we did. The new tongue and the replacement brackets will far outlast all of the rest of the trailer. But I digress...

I put the sanding flap cylinder (80 grit) on it and used it to grind to the scribe line as exactly as possible. It left a surface condition that looks like it was machined! I'm good with that.

Next I removed the bellhousing and transmission so I could lay out the bolt holes and alignment dowel holes. Now I laid out a center line, and a perpendicular line at the bottom edge where the lowest 2 bellhousing bolt holes go, and aligned the bellhousing over it. Clamped the bellhousing onto the plate and located the center of the holes.

FYI I have an antique set of expanding transfer punches, made by DoAll, probably 65 to 70 years ago. I've replaced the small locating punches numerous times as its easy to damage them. A piece of drill rod, or lately a pure tungsten electrode from the tig, and back in business. I've drilled all of the holes, and it fits just fine.
Here's the engine plate in the proper position between the engine and bellhousing. I'll need an extended pilot bearing, 1/4 inch, but that's available from Speedway or Summit, or probably the engine shop.

Tomorrow, set the engine angle and setback and the height of the engine so the pan is just slightly above the bottom tubes, and start working on the flanges to bolt it all back together.

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

Forgot to mention, the top of the plate needs to be radiused after the height is set. I'm thinking that I need to update the to do list as well... before well,

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

No pictures today, but I made a lot of progress. Figured out how to bolt that plate to the cowl support hoop. Spent all day put it together, take it apart, repeat until the lightbulb moment! Got some welding left for tomorrow then see if it works. If yes, you'll see it here, if no, well I'll start over.

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

Pictures first in no particular order, cuz I'm computer challenged .

After making the stuff in the next couple of pictures, I took old mangy out and got it on the engine stand. BTW that stand was one of the first serious welding projects that I ever did. I made it in the summer of 1972, as I was putting small blocks in and out of my CJ5 routinely. Went thru about 4 327 junk yard refugees before a $25 283 went in as a last resort. It lasted 13 months, which was a month longer than I owned it. It was replaced by a 307 truck engine and I got the crank back. Still have it out in the garage.

Okay, back to the pictures. I didn't have any clear pictures of the Vega steering box installed, as I worked around old mangy getting it installed. You can also see the first of what will probably be a few, crossmembers with diagonal bracing. That upper crossmember behind the nose might be temporary or not. Depends on clearance Clarence .

The last 3 pictures show the engine plate from the outside and the cowl support hoop mated to it from the inside. I'm going to make 2 diagonal braces to go fro about 8 inches up the cowl support hoop down to the frame, well the extensions on each side that the body sits on, with gussets on the underside. They'll tuck tight to the body and drop down to a point just below the door openings, so that when I make the passenger door open, it won't intrude on the opening.

Now I thought that the plate I have was big enough to look okay, but I hate the gaps, so...

Tomorrow I'll be ordering a new section of 1/4-inch tooling plate, 24x27 at a minimum. That will completely cover the firewall once contoured to match. As I have been collecting parts for Son of Whatever, the current plate won't go to waste. But that's another story!

So that's all for now. Be sure to tune in for the continuing adventures of the Whatever Project, the project that hasn't got a clue

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

Ordered a new piece of aluminum plate today. I'm not happy with the gaps around the edges of the plate and body, so make another one. Not too crazy a price. It is however one of the more expensive single purchases so far. $200 + tax. Oh well I can't take it with me.

Or maybe I can. I'll have myself buried in it!

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

More Pictures!
Diagonal braces for the cowl support hoop and the engine plate on the other side. 1 inch 1/8 wall DOM. That's the end of the 1st 20 foot section. I can't believe that it's almost all in the Whatever. There's maybe a foot in small sections in the short bucket. Anyway, the idea for this bracing layout came to me during a dream. As you may remember, there's a steel plate under the body floor flanges. The first picture shows the attachment method Icame up with.

That's a short section of the tubing capped off with a 3/16 inch thick plug, cut out with a hole saw. That left a 1/4 inch hole thru the plug. I drilled thru the body with the same hole saw, again leaving the pilot hole thru the steel flange. After welding the plug in the bottom of the tube, I dropped a bolt thru it, and bolted it down to the flange on both sides. Using a 1 inch strip of cardboard I set the angles and lengths for the diagonal tubes.

Using a tubing notcher, set at the angles zip zip fish mouthed tubes. A little bit of touch up grinding to perfect the fit, and weld it all together. Well tacks for now. I'm leaving most of the finish welding for after the Whatever is 99% finished.

And I'm going to make gussets on the underside of the flanges that support those diagonals properly. There's going to be a couple of gussets where the rear roll bar support hoop attaches to the flanges as well. Those gussets will double as supports for the exhaust system.

It's been a good week for the Whatever project. I got a lot of the structure designed and fabricated, and I got transmission bits and bobs to rebuild the shortened T10 I have back into a complete working transmission.

[DanStokes]

Thanks for dragging us along on this. Second best thing to living across town and dropping in regularly! I DO wish we lived closer but I'm not giving up our great weather (whether?).

Dan

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

Yeah, us too! Especially when I talk paint. Maggie just rolls her eyes...

So here's today's little slice of upstate New York. It's warm, mid 80's and sunny. I didn't do much, but it looks impressive. Right is before, left is after.

I decided that since the engine plate was going to be the same size as the firewall of the body, that it would look nice engine turned.

So after a little bit of sleuthing the internet thing, and seeing what people have done, I figured what have I got to loose. Using the cutout from the current plate and some 2 inch diameter surface conditioning discs in the drill press, theleft picture is what was accomplished, purely by eye and luck.

The point being yes, those surface conditioning discs work just fine on aluminum plate. If you look closely at the the finished product upper middle a couple of swirls don't look too good. That's where I learned to not press too hard on the drill press handle. The plastic lock nub pushed thru and then broke. Light pressure is all that's needed.

Onwards and upwards!

[DanStokes]

Yeah, us too! Especially when I talk paint. Maggie just rolls her eyes...

So here's today's little slice of upstate New York. It's warm, mid 80's and sunny. I didn't do much, but it looks impressive. Right is before, left is after.

I decided that since the engine plate was going to be the same size as the firewall of the body, that it would look nice engine turned.

So after a little bit of sleuthing the internet thing, and seeing what people have done, I figured what have I got to loose. Using the cutout from the current plate and some 2 inch diameter surface conditioning discs in the drill press, theleft picture is what was accomplished, purely by eye and luck.

The point being yes, those surface conditioning discs work just fine on aluminum plate. If you look closely at the the finished product upper middle a couple of swirls don't look too good. That's where I learned to not press too hard on the drill press handle. The plastic lock nub pushed thru and then broke. Light pressure is all that's needed.

Onwards and upwards!

I've done a bit of that and with good luck. I clearcoated mine with clear wheel paint and it seems to hold up OK. It's just a spray can - you can DO that! For smaller pieces a pencil eraser in the drill press works, too.

[dave.g.in.gansevoort]

I've done a bit of that and with good luck. I clearcoated mine with clear wheel paint and it seems to hold up OK. It's just a spray can - you can DO that! For smaller pieces a pencil eraser in the drill press works, too.

I saw videos of the eraser method. Can you imagine doing a 2x3 foot plate with a pencil eraser? People also mentioned clear coats and other treatments. Gibbs oil for instance. I'm going to experiment with the small scrap and see what works for me.

I'm going to use my radial arm drill press for the final firewall, but first I have to make an extension table and a guide fence. Some 3/4 plywood should do, and the fence left over from a router table 20 years ago. Never throw anything out!