I know the allure of an older muscle car well: the purely mechanical nature of the car. The vibration of a V8 with a good cam thumping, shaking the car ever so slightly. The torque delivery, the lack of electronics, the smell of the exhaust, and the looks that polarize fifty years after they stepped out onto the scene. But I also know their downfalls, and I’m fully aware of the inflated stories that have told over the decades about stock Hemi cars running twelves and GTOs that would lift a tire at launch straight off of the showroom floor. And I’m not the only one out there: while digging through Moparts, I found a thread called, “Stock sucks??” On Moparts, that’s pushing the threshold of blasphemy…so naturally, I looked.
Here’s the basic concept: Musclecars from the 1960s and 1970s felt stout for years. They were hot when they were new, and when newer cars got neutered, they still felt like stompers. It helped identify the real performance leaders when the early turnaround occurred in the 1980s…when a Grand National and a 5.0 Mustang could run with the older class, that’s when they got respect. But look at what you have now: it’s nothing for a family car to rip a 15-second quarter, you have plenty of cars in the 13-14 second range, you have the factory sociopaths that are pushing 10 seconds, and you have things that just didn’t really happen back in 1970: handling, brakes, all-wheel-drive, turbocharged four-bangers that could leave a big-block in the dust, and traction control systems that could meter out the right amount of wheelspin before stepping in to get the show going. A Ford Taurus SHO is an honest threat to a bone-stock 429CJ Torino in the quarter mile, and it will out-stop and out-corner it as well. Plus, you can drive it anywhere without people freaking out about it’s looks. Grandma will get into a Taurus…she isn’t going to get into “that hot rod!”
On the other coin, we have all of the Pro Touring rides that do it all. They have the looks, the power, the handling and the ability to stop. But they all come with huge price tags before the restoration part of the build is factored in. For someone on a shoestring budget, it’s a matter of compromise: do you go late-model and get a good overall car or do you go older and give something up? Is it worth spending big bucks to upgrade older iron, or are they now at the point where they should be enjoyed as they were, like a Auburn or Duesenberg?
I see nothing wrong with taking something like a 1969 GTO or Chevelle SS 396 that doesn’t have it’s original drive train and spending the money to add things like upgraded suspension, 4 wheel disc brakes, a 6 speed manual trans, rack and pinion steering – all things that weren’t available back in 1969. You get the looks of a 1969 Muscle Car and the driveability of a modern car. Stick a GM or 3rd party like Jeggs crate engine in it and you have yourself a car that is a blast to drive; straight or around curves and the looks that will turn heads.
OK… I have a `73 351 Falcon coupe ( Aussie) and for my family car an ex police pursuit 98 EL Falcon which has Tickford suspension and a hot roller Windsor from the factory… to be honest, the 98 is a bit quicker in a straight line, definitely quicker around corners, but tell you what, I’ll take the coupe for a more fun ride any day of the week. Its worth more, turns heads etc but that’s irrelevant. Its more FUN !!!
I think the old cars will always have a soul and a personality that new cars rarely have. But from a financial standpoint, no way. Look at when Stielow’s Red Devil got matched up against a new ZL-1: performance was fairly close but the ZL-1 is sub-$60K and Stielow wouldn’t cop to the price of the ’69 but he did say it was around $200K
For my money and in my opinion … there is nothing better than a seriously done Resto Mod …. be it muscle car , exotic [ I\’m a sucker for Outlaw 356s and 911s ] etc .
Even better ? Building an IRS hot rod capable of kicking the crap out of an exotic or two ….
But … as Nick D so well stated … you are gonna pay a hell of a lot more to make that resto-mod / hot rod to match many of todays cars performance .. but somehow … it still feels worth it .
If for no other reason than what you\’ll be driving isn\’t available off the showroom floor to any idiot and his/her brother with a big enough checkbook
😉
I don’t know about that. (See also: Barrett-Jackson, Mecum, etc)
I was referring to building your own .. not buying someone else\’s project … and I\’m guessing so was Nick D
FYI ; A wise man never buys anything from any auction anywhere .. period ! The only worse market place than the auction houses being the internet
PS ; Any luck getting the techno-wonks to fix this .. \’ .. \” …. little programing error that places a serious damper on correct punctuation Bryan ?
Yeah, I was referring to building your own. I have seen some steals at B-J though. There was a certain Pro Touring ’70 Dart with a 528 Hemi that a guy built, estimated $75,000 into it. Took it there and the battery died and couldn’t get the car to start so it had to be pushed across the block. Everybody got real wary so it only sold for $25,000 (no reserve) and all it needed it was a battery. Somebody went home real sad and somebody went home real sad.
Thats the thing about building your own . Do it to please yourself and meet your needs/wants .. not as an investment with the vain hope of every making any money from it down the road . Neal East who is a very good friend told me years ago the best way to do a Hot Rod etc on the cheap is to buy someone elses vision that comes close to what you want .. at pennies on the dollar of what it cost to build … then do a couple of minor things to it to match your ideal as close as possible without breaking the bank
About the only exceptions to Neals Rule Ive seen have been the rare build for a celebrity [ of serious note ] or by a celebrity builder . And even then its rare they meet the original cost of the build .. never mind make a profit
As to the auction house thing … yeah … there are the occasional bargains to be found .. the problem being a lot of times even the bargains are over priced compared to Street value due to alcohol and ego driven bidding … so overall the best way to buy a classic or a used hot rod / muscle car is direct from an owner you know you can trust . e.g Connections . It may take longer …. but in the long run .. its worth it
I can relate as an owner of an 87 Grand National, what made these cars great for 20 years was the ability, with minimal mods and $$, to stay ahead (straight line performance) of what detroit was pumping out.
Now with the ZO6, ZR1, GTR and other 10 sec et monsters, I’ve had to upgrade the LC2 with everything, fuel system, billet trans, roller cam, stroker, big turbo to keep up and maintain reliability.
I can’t bring myself to take the easy way out and drop in a turbo’d LS for a fraction of the money.
Topic of conversation with my friends everytime talk turns to mods and performance.
One friend has a very well done 70 BOSS 302 track car , real BOSS engine, time capsule mods stopped at 1970. Car built to Vintage rules. Some guy showed up with a Z06 ‘vette and was right with him for lap times,just gas ,no leaks drove home AC on.
Other pal is a drag racer for years, tirering of the work a stock 14 Mustang is looking good.
My big block 68 Mustang resto modded rides hard , is loud , requires tinkering etc….. Late Model B302 is looking good to me.Less work.
But my Mustang is a time capsule for me , the way back machine , I did everything except hold the paint gun, it would take a large stack of $100 to make it go away.
It depends on your goals. A new performance car makes sense if your goal is something like “I can afford to spend $40,000 and want my next car to be as fast as possible for minimal effort.”
Muscle car era builds aren’t quite the speed bargain they used to be, but they can still make sense. There’s still useable cars in the $4000 and under range if you go for something that doesn’t command a premium.
Muscle cars have a presence and panache that’s hard to match with a newer car. If that’s a key goal, a new car won’t scratch that itch. For that matter, I don’t regret that I ended up spending about what an early LS powered truck would cost to build an LS powered ’72 Chevy pickup, for about the same reason. A beater ’72 Chevy truck just has more appeal to me than a beater ’02 Chevy truck.
If you’re NOT doing some max effort, Red Devil style build, muscle cars can respond quite well to some basic tweaks. Good springs, shocks, sway bars, junkyard brakes, and some minor mods like offset bushings or welded on gussets can get you a long way. To say nothing of how straightforward it is to wake up the engines.
If your goal is to build something for the challenge and the satisfaction of working with your own hands, again, building your own is the only choice because building your own project car is the whole point.
And there’s the buy in price. I can’t afford to buy a new Camaro. I can afford to have the ’72 Chevy truck and my ’66 Dart, and occasionally throw some performance parts at them.
For me, a better question might be if it makes sense to start with something muscle car era or something from the ’80s or ’90s that has hit the bottom of the depreciation curve and still offers tons of mod potential. Come to think of that, I happen to have one of those too. 🙂
I see nothing wrong with upgrading vintage iron to today’s performance, as I currently own a 1974 Dodge D100 Club Cab with a 2007 5.7 Hemi.
The truck is fully restored on the outside, it isn’t until you look under the hood and inside the cab you see the modern features.
What started my project off was I wanted fuel injection and overdrive for my truck to tow the Duster with to long distance meets / drag races.
The driveline came out of a 2007 Dodge Maxi Cab rolling chassis that I bought for $3000, used a Street and Performance wiring kit and motor mounts, Corvette p/s pump, Ididit steering column.
The 5.7 Hemi is stock other than a hand fabricated cold air intake and block hugger headers. I have the best of both worlds with this truck of mine.
You can get a really nice, damn quick modern engineered muscle car for $50K plus and have a good time. I can buy a lot of parts for my old hot rod for $50K. I could build two nice street/strip cars from scratch for that IMHO. Not the same to me, different uses. If I was going to spend 40~50K on a vehicle it’s be a F350. But there are plenty of parts out there that can make old old body learn the new tricks. I think it’ll just cost you more in the end. Car Craft has an article about a guy upgrading his 5.0 Mustang. The sleeved 5.0 block was $7500 for just that. Not many of us have than kind of stick to throw around on our fun rides. 5 years on a 2014 Shelby Mustang at 2.9 is $987 for 6 years. No way in hell I’ll pay that for any kind of car.
This has to be the Best Written and Well Thought Out article to ever appear on this site. Nevermind the April Fools curse. See how intelligent you can sound without multiple ‘awesomes’ in the text. Not all hot rodders are stupid drooling idiots. Think about It.
Today, I stand and Salute you.
Res ipsa loquitur – The thing speaks for itself
After owning my 1st fuel injected vehicle back in the late 80’s, never owned an old car again. Had a Camaro, Chevelle, Cuda, Duster, and a few others, but I never want touch a carb again!
No doubt modern drivetrains are awesome. In the hot rod world, IMO, the LS series engine is the new King. I never thought the Small Block Chevrolet would be dethroned, but I believe it has.
In fact, I’ve considered both an LT1 and LS1 for my 1967 Impala, but they just don’t look “right”. I’m sticking with the tried and true SBC because I’m going for more “resto” than “mod”.
This is why I own the Mustang/Fury/Ram and the motorcycle…I got all the bases covered…..
I hate car payments, so my choice will always be old, irrelevant, unloved iron. My wife gets the amazing new cars. I get to drag home rusty hulks. Their paid off the day I buy them. I’m all for cramming in whatever drive train, suspension, interior ect. you can afford in there. I’m trying to put nissan disc on my AMC’s rear axle, while I save up for a cummins or LS swap. Who cares as long as you enjoy it.
Do you realize you just asked if it was worth it to hot rod a car?
To someone that doesn’t get it, the answer is easy: NO!
To me, the answer is: What kind of a question is that? We’re gear heads, grease monkeys, racers, and hotrodders. It’s what we do. It’s in our blood. It doesn’t matter if it’s brand new or 100 years old, we’re going to mess with it.
Amen to that! Preach it brother!
short answer: yes it is worth it.
ramblings why I justify it:
Pros
– my car the way I want it
– unlike what the next guy is driving (unless I build a Mustang of Camaro)
– sense of accomplishment that I made my car handle/ perform better than when I bought it
– smog exempt here in sunny so cal
– I can work on it without being at the mercy of the dealership and their exclusive computer equipment
– I can replace actual parts that are not entire “assemblies” that new cars seem to have
– won’t depreciate like a new car
– cheaper registration here in ca (based on purchase price)
Cons
-expensive (and so is a new performance car, too. And so is their insurance and registration)
– time consuming to build