I have a hypothetical situation for you to think about. Don’t immediately answer it, just ponder it for a minute: At whatever meet up, or race, or show, or whatever you do that involves cars and socializing, a sixteen year old kid rolls up with a car…for the sake of discussion, let’s say it’s a rough 1954 Buick two-door packing a junkyard LS and four-speed auto out of a truck…nothing built up, just a modern engine in classic metal, good enough to be street legal but no doubt rough. The kid knows their shit, and judging from some of the repairs it’s obvious that they’ve been the wrench…it isn’t going to win an award but they are undoubtedly proud of their achievement. What is your initial assessment of the situation? Are you impressed that another young gun is getting into the hobby and are willing to spin wrenches themselves? Did you look at the Buick and say a quiet thank-you that it’s not another wound-up Honda go-kart? Did you look at the LS engine and immediately write off the whole project while making a mental note to teach the kid what a real engine is? Are you glad to see that the builder had the foresight to build a driver that they are enjoying, or does it kill you that you have yet another entrant into the automotive world who won’t know the joys of a three-on-the-tree?
I hope you haven’t answered a question yet, because this is something that has bothered me over the last month or so. I’ve hit a variety of shows, from Fontanel, which would fit the typical lawn-chair vibe, to the Redneck Rumble, which is, at best, a pre-1977 celebration of “build, don’t buy”. I even had a conversation close to this at the Nashville Boogie car show, which is a pre-1972 deal that discourages anything more modern than, say…1975 on any car unless it’s a GM one-wire alternator. That apparently got a pass. The question I posed, narrowed down, was what would happen if the kid in question rolled up to a meet that involved most of the types that were showing, what would happen? The response: they would welcome the kid and be positive about their mechanical prowess and choice of car, but would “correct” them on the engine choice…and if they didn’t conform to what the group had to say, then they wouldn’t be welcomed around anymore. “Correct” them. Because someone who has a bias against an engine series feels that they need to correct an up-and-coming gearhead on why they need to hate said engine series.
I’ve been dwelling on this for a little bit now, because the idea that if your car isn’t up to someone else’s snuff, then you’ll be told to F.O. somewhere else burns me. The kid in the story has more going for themselves in the automotive world that a lot of people who claim they are car people do: they made an excellent choice in wheels, classic but fairly uncommon, probably saved it from rotting further into the weeds, and are out driving the damn thing. Some guys with late-model muscle don’t drive their cars on the street! This kid is proud of what they’ve managed to accomplish with what money, time and talent they have, and at sixteen I’ll speak from experience: I didn’t have much of any of those gifts and felt lucky when I was able to put time in on my rides. So, tell me: who are you to walk up to this kid and tell them that their work is garbage and that they are pretty much persona non grata, just because they picked the “wrong” engine in your eyes? And it doesn’t have to be an LS engine, either…I just went with that because everybody loves to hate it. They might have raided a TPI 350 from the carcass of a trashed-out Camaro, or a 4.3L V6 out of an S-10, or whatever. But to have someone walk up to this kid, who is venturing out to find like-minded people who share the same hobby they are interested in only to be told that they did it wrong, that their engine choice was wrong, to make cracks about how someone obviously had to have built it for them because what young kid would bother building such a car in the first place…and yet it’s often brought up about how there are no youth in the game anymore. No shit, Sherlock, I wonder why.
And let’s take it one step further: let’s swap out the Buick for any other car. Literally, ANY other car. I might be the champion of the completely random, “WTF…why do you like that car?!” mentality around here, but I understand that when you’re cash-down, you do what you can. So let’s say that LS and automatic would up in the otherwise trashed shell of a Fox Mustang. What then? Are you going to make the kid a pariah because they built up a combination that is obviously working? Going to call them out on their original idea? Or let’s say that they decided to turn the wick up on an Escort ZX2. Ford offered a factory suspension package that would make that otherwise forgettable coupe race. It wouldn’t be all that fast, but it’d corner like a scared cat on carpet…you going to dismiss them as a ricer and tell them to get lost? Maybe they have a hand-me-down Buick Century that isn’t modded except for the hand-painted pinstripes that they worked their asses off to make look decent. It’s just a grandma’s Buick…why’d you bother? Sound familiar?
So let’s go through the questions I asked before…I doubt that there would be any knock against the Buick. Why would you say to a kid with a limited budget regarding the engine? When you point out the flaws in their work, would you explain the right way to do things? Would you step up and offer a bit of education that would put them on the right path? What if the car isn’t a ’54 Buick at all, but a 1997 Integra with a wicked little B18 or K20…would you laugh them out for bringing the Honda and keep bashing them until they left? And here’s a final thought: while reading this, how many times did you mentally change out the gender neutral pronouns, like they, kid, and so on for male pronouns, because you don’t expect a sixteen-year-old girl to be involved with cars?
Just think about it.
BMT…Your over thinking this. Kick back, get a nice beverage of your choice and some healthy snacks and r e l a x…
It has been this way forever.. sadly the gearheads are thar own worst enemy.
Most is sent back in time would find issue with the first hot rod junk yard builds.
Just look at the HAMM, first hot rods was take what you could find and build..
yet they will turn away anything that doesn’t use “correct” parts.. That are not avail. and when found cost an arm and leg..
Most rat rods, before it became a fad/trend was closer to the old hot rodders than much of what the HAMM members own drive..
As they screwed together what ever they could find..
They walk through a yard and see a 40 buick frame, a 47 ford body, a g body rear, a 300cid inline ford 6 and weld.
Same with the kid in the story above with a buick, took what was avail in th junk yards, that is cheap.. and made it work..
Gearheads and hot rodders have forgot where they came from and how it started.. Yet, they’ll tell everyone what is a traditional rod.. pfft
The Hamb is the worst for this exact thing!! Some of the biggest duchebags. (Second to corvette owners) to ever have web site !! And they believe all the crap they spew in real life!
“And here’s a final thought: while reading this, how many times did you mentally change out the gender neutral pronouns, like they, kid, and so on for male pronouns, because you don’t expect a sixteen-year-old girl to be involved with cars?”
Good lord, the PC police are here.
One should really be using ZER and ZE, nes pas?
I have been asked at carshows of what I think of the unfinished car. I will be honest and tell them” I never built them that way on purpose” or the fact that I like the car but not the style I like. BUT not everybody liked our original cars from the 60’s. All jacked up tailpipe hanging down,tinted windows,lights in our painted wheel wells, painted white wheels, and a Sunoco 260 decal.
I was at Fontanel show this past week and can attest to the feel of the show. In fact, a friend commented on how inappropriate it was for a stock-looking, later-model van to be parked amoungst the other vehicles on the grass.
If it’s special to you, then that’s all that matters. Ask me how I know… http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum/bangshift/project-cars-update/1058566-1975-camino-royale
A girl and a turbo Subaru 4. Only tool in the picture is a hammer. I rest my case.
Until we can legally shoot haters, there will always be haters. If you want to build to troll haters, great, have at it. If you want to build to show the world what you can do, great, have at it. But whatever you do, never, ever make the mistake of building something for anyone else but yourself.
In this day of internet, you could surround yourself with like-minded individuals, and there will always be some bloke in Kentucky that will travel all the way across the internet to tell you that you’re doing it wrong.
I don’t even think it’s even a case of the old guard vs the young guns. I think people in the hobby of all ages are guilty of it.
I’ve seen this issue brought up by, a lot of automotive internet writers & YouTubers over the last little while. I tend to agree with opinion they have brought forward.
At the end of the day, if you see someones build and its not the way you would build it. Then go out and buy a similar car and build it the way you would.
But don’t tell someone, that they built their car wrong. Just because it wasn’t what you would do.
It’s their property and they have every right to do, what they want to do with it.
And at the end of the day, what you think of it really doesn’t matter.
The only thing that matters, is that someone is involved in the hobby. And they’re having fun with their vision of what the perfect build is.
I love the look modern , efficient drive train old body not so shinny your afraid to drive it
$10,000 paint jobs don’t impress me
SBG from above has it right in my eyes. In my opinion there is no “true gear head” … there are only other peoples opinions. You can find like minded people no matter what you are into. Build it the way that makes you happy and treat other peoples opinions like a grain of salt.
If there were no haters / no it all’s then you would not have written this. The car scene needs shit talkers and drama just like every other hobby. Everything is good in moderation … even negativity.
PS: LS / 302 / 350 / 4.3 “boring” motor swaps are widely accepted in the pre 1972 car culture that i have witnessed (yes even hamb). Its all about what type of build and how its executed.
Where’s Geordie ?
As long as it’s cool I dig it. If I hated on anything it would be those guys who buy a brand new Challenger and do nothing to it except drive it straight to a car show. I’d personally rather see a Prius with a agricultural hit and miss stuffed under the hood.
First off, when looking at any car, if I have something to say positive, I say it. If it is negative, I keep it to myself. The owner did not ask my opinion nor do I have the right to condemn there build for any reason. I treat others with the same respect I expect to get when showing off my truck. I realize that a vehicle will not be everyone’s cup of tea- just keep the negative stuff to yourself. If you don’t like it, move on. There’s no need to insult someones work.
As for a kid with an old car and an LS- been there done that. Ran across a young guy with 50 Chevy truck with an LS in it. I asked “why an LS?” and he said because they are easy to swap in and easy to find. I had nothing negative to say as I am still learning at the age of 50. It got me into looking into LS swaps myself.
If you think about what was affordable to build even 20 years ago when I started driving, and what kids these days have to start with now no you can’t hate. I had a choice 79 malibu for free or spend 3500 on a crap shell of a camaro. I built what I could afford. So I say help guide the youth. It was done for me. As far as the ls swap it would be cool to have it as an original but build what you like, afford, and know!
First off, I will defend the right of a car show organizer to pick a particular theme for their show. If they want it to be only cars with a 1972 or earlier model year, or all British cars, or 1950s period correct hot rods, that’s their prerogative. But the flip side is that the organizers need to clearly spell out what is eligible for the show when they advertise it. Say that it’s anything 1972 or earlier without any further restrictions? OK, I’ll assume my ’72 beater truck with the LS swap would have been allowed in. Anything goes? Don’t throw a hissy fit if anything does. If the organizers fail to effectively communicate what their show is about, they have no right to complain about unexpected cars showing up.
I don’t recall any time someone’s told me to my face that they didn’t like whatever car I’ve brought to a meet. Sometimes I’ve had people express that it isn’t their cup of tea by not paying any attention to my car, but hey, nobody’s forcing them to look at cars they’re not interested in.
I don’t find the negative at all. Not in the sense of what you read on the internet, the internet and web pages let a lot of people vent and write things they would not ever say in person. Internet makes you rude and brave! 🙂 That being said, I can vouch most 99% of the people would enjoy the car and the youth involved. And that type of car would bring up some good old conversation. Some guy from the 50’s, ya need to find a big Cadillac engine for that thing! Some would be intimidated because there is no carburetor! But none of it in negativity, the car itself would bring up old days and new days with the power plant. Have to understand some car people are still mad they stopped building the flat head, and believe to this day it’s the most powerful reliable engine ever made. the verity of response is never ending. the guy who had one new, the guy who lost his virginity in one. The guy who just can’t believe you removed the original engine. The purest, who thinks every car should be preserved to it’s original and never changed. But none of it in hate. And all are very happy to see the young involved. Personally, I would be very impressed.
The only thing I hate on is an obvious disregard to safety. Otherwise, you do you, Boo-Boo. I see things I like and things I don’t in almost every car. Hell, I even hated the Riddler winner from a couple years back. There is no pleasing everyone so why try…please yourself, at the end of the day that is all that matters….(that did not come out right but you get the idea)
I have to confess to not being a fan of the “easy” swaps, but I’ll always appreciate the effort involved in making the magic happen.
A couple of years back, I used to bag on other cars because of things I felt weren’t “pure” or were too “easy” until I had a friend ask me rather bluntly: “Can’t you just like things?”
That was some great take-home advice: people put a lot of work an effort into their projects. It’s theirs, let them enjoy it, and maybe you can find something to appreciate in the process.
As a millennial hotrodder who has dedicated his life to the craft, I can attest that it’s not necessarily the car that breeds discontent at times, but how our age bracket of rodders are perceived. I’ve been building and modifying cars for 16 years(started at 15,31 now), and the lack of respect shown to us by the older crowd is saddening. It doesn’t seem to matter what the build is,or it’s quality, many of the old guard assume three things.1) we didn’t build it,but had someone else turn the wrenches.2) we didn’t pay for it,instead the assumption is made our parents or student loans footed the bill. 3) it will be crashed in short order,because we have no respect for anything. In my case, I get reverence from my peers and am seen as a leader in rodding in my city because of my experience. The older set seems to completely disregard our efforts, no matter what we show up in,as they believe none of us have the hands necessary to craft and were playing games. I needed some hard to find parts to complete a restoration on a chevelle I recently finished. I approached an elder who is known in our city as a leader of the rodding community, a chevelle guy, hoping to build a rapport with him to help gain some knowledge on these particular cars,their eccentricities, and help in locating what I needed. He crumpled up my business card and I’m sure discarded it after my approach, all while giving me the attitude that “you can’t restore a chevelle,and your not going to.” I finished the car, it’s stunning, and I hope to turn him on his ear this year when I debut the car at our local car meet. Honestly, not to sound cheesy, but like Paul walker said ” the respect means more to some.” Is this the proper attitude to have? No,not at all. But I feel I’ve been forced to be this way,as I will not be dissuaded and undermined in the craft I’ve dedicated my life to. There are many like us out there,looking for guidance, not a helping hand, in carrying on the torch for the next generation.